Saracens - naughty naughty, very naughty

[Nopace]

If the definition of ‘salary’ has any holes in it, that have been used then there will no fine and no points deduction, however they may tighten it up for next season which means that there could be some players back on the market in the summer. 

[baldpaul101]

if players have already been set up with investment vehicles "for their future" could these be taken away from them if Sarries were found to have breached the rules?

Whatever the outcome it WILL have an impact. Even if its whitewashed away, then other clubs will start doing the same or similar.

[andermt]

If you desire, full regulations are here.

https://d2cx26qpfwuhvu.cloudfront.net/premier/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/03161651/Salary-Cap-Regulations-2018-19.pdf


For me the interesting line is in Schedule 1 - Amounts that constitute salary.

(p) any payment or benefit in kind which the Player would not have received if it were not for his involvement with a Club;

[MattWasp]

If they are quick about the deduction that puts Sarries in the relegation fight.

That will be an interesting point for Tigers fans who might be wondering why their board didn’t set up a Kaino-Read-Cane coffee chain as a solution to their relegation woes

[NellyWellyWaspy]

If you desire, full regulations are here.

https://d2cx26qpfwuhvu.cloudfront.net/premier/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/03161651/Salary-Cap-Regulations-2018-19.pdf


For me the interesting line is in Schedule 1 - Amounts that constitute salary.

(p) any payment or benefit in kind which the Player would not have received if it were not for his involvement with a Club;

There can be no doubt that the financial assistance given by Sarries in these cases is most certainly a benefit in kind, in that the investments, were it to return a capital gain or profit, said profit or gain accrues entirely to the player. Unless, it can be demonstrated that the monies involved are repayable, at commercial rates, in a way that an individual not associated with the club could have obtained privately. It would be interesting to know if the club and players have declared these monies as benefits in kind on their tax returns.

The rules should be amended to read:

(p)  any payment or benefit in kind (as defined from time to time by Inland Revenue) which the Player would not have received if it were not for his involvement with a Club;

[Trevs Big Tackle]

If Wray thought Daly's Briefcase business was so attractive for investment then he wouldn't have to wait for Daly to sign for Saracens to invest...

[W2APS]

Would Wray be investing with them if they weren't Saracens employees? Almost certainly not. Therefore it stinks.

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[wasps]

Would Wray be investing with them if they weren't Saracens employees? Almost certainly not. Therefore it stinks.

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Is that Wray's get out here though?
If he now goes into business with Joe Launchbury on the same kind of basis as he has with his own players, does that then mean that it's something not specifically tied to Saracens and therefore perfectly legal?

[Tervueren]

He might have to invest with a few more than one to get away with that ruse. The proportion of fellow-investors who are Saracens would still make it probably they only got anything because of it. Maybe he could give us all some money?

[Neils]

Just caught this when having lunch -
https://mol.im/a/6933703

[Vespula Vulgaris]

Interesting that he is being so vocal this time.

[RBB]

Dimes sitting on his hands as usual ;-) However, I fear nothing will happen and it will be brushed under the carpet.

[BG]

I think the last time it happened it was in the earlier stages of the salary cap and most of the teams probably didn't want to rock the boat (in fact, how much detail were the clubs given about the first breach). Its been reported that most of the clubs are in a much less forgiving frame of mind this time around.

[Marlow Nick]

Don't forget that on top of these co-investments with the top players Sarries also stretch the training/team building definition way past credibility to the point that it looks suspiciously like you get all-expenses-paid holidays as well - very nice if you're a young player on a relatively low wage and an incentive to sit on the bench rather than move clubs.

I suspect there is a very long list of grey interpretations that many outsiders would say are additional benefits. Personally as well as investigating Sarries I'd like to see a general tightening of the rules for all clubs - for example training and team building trips only count if WAGs are not present. If your partner is there (even if you pay for them) then it's a holiday and falls inside the cap.

[RBB]

Some interesting comments from the Gloucester chairman, it looks like clubs that are operating within the limits are a bit sick and tired of those that operate outside by whatever means, or any loopholes they have identified. Perhaps the will and cohesion of the other clubs may spur the RFU into some sort of action this time around.

“There’s a strong determination in all the other chairmen and owners that they want to get to the bottom of this and if somebody has been cheating they face the punishments.”

https://www.gloucestershirelive.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/gloucester-rugby-fans-forum-key-2770323