Last Minute Change for Wasps.

[Eezamarlowman]

Dai has a lot of work ahead of him. Gnarly 2nd row has to be a priority signing. The worrying thing for me is that the team has proved capable at certain stages so it’s not an ability thing.  I don’t feel they are thinking correctly which sits mainly with coaches and management in my opinion. Motivation and psychology are/should be amongst their responsibilities. Time to earn your corn Mr Young, but you should insist on some help with coach(s) coming in. The fans deserve better than what we have had this year. Onwards and upwards

[Rossm]

The 2nd row is a major concern now, as soon as we lost Gaskell I was worried but luckily joe is so good he kept us in the game but when joe went off that was the end of the game.

We need a quality 2nd row as a must, we have no engine room without Joe and Gaskell

Absolutely correct. Once Gaskell got injured (back spasm I think) in the warm up, Rowlands had to move up and start. Presumably we didn't bring Charlie Matthews or Kearan Myall as a travelling reserve which was a pity. Having to move Nathan into the second row when Joe went off left us without his drive off the back of the scrum.

[Heathen]

I thought that Shields is the dual purpose back row/lock not Nate. Eddie certainly does.

[Westy68]

Dai has a lot of work ahead of him. Gnarly 2nd row has to be a priority signing. The worrying thing for me is that the team has proved capable at certain stages so it’s not an ability thing.  I don’t feel they are thinking correctly which sits mainly with coaches and management in my opinion. Motivation and psychology are/should be amongst their responsibilities. Time to earn your corn Mr Young, but you should insist on some help with coach(s) coming in. The fans deserve better than what we have had this year. Onwards and upwards

I totally agree, we have no direction due to poor coaching and have left it to individual brilliance, which we got away with due to the quality of players we had.

We have traded down this season and therefore the coaching is really showing it’s not up to it.

I don’t know how to sort it out, do we give Dai time or get another coach. Just really upset at the moment and I struggling to see it will get better next season

[Rossm]

I thought that Shields is the dual purpose back row/lock not Nate. Eddie certainly does.

And Eddie thinks Elliot is a full back. Enough said?

[NellyWellyWaspy]

A team where the sum of the parts are less and not more than the total.

There are some individuals on the team who don't buy into 'the plan'. WLR is one.

Given where we are, with one game left and little to play for other than pride and a home crowd that wants to see a TEAM playing, if I were Dai, I would mix it up for this last game. Let WLR have a 'rest', give Miller the FB position. Maybe give a couple of youngsters a start and see how they fare.

We have a situation where the coaching team have all season trained the team to a plan, and where, almost all season, some of the team have then ignored said plan. We have a disconnect between team and management. In normal businesses, the business would fail and cease to exist. We are losing a good portion of the squad this year, but we also need the coaching to change.

The coaches and team seem to be working against each other. That needs to change. The grumblings suggest that the team are telling the coaches that the 'plan' does not work, but the coaches are insisting that the fault lies with the players. So some players have gotten fed up and have disconnected. There needs to be a very frank discussion with senior players and coaches, where the players are not shot down, otherwise we could see a much worse year next year.

My experience of working inside organisations that have such issues is that it is almost always 90% the problem of management. That's where we need the clearout. The main squad coaches. Once you have lost the trust of the players, they will leave, and they have. Those you can replace. The management you must replace. Not saying that is Dai, but the guys under him have done a piss poor job this year.

[Fats]

Some thoughts an where we have "issues"

WLR is a conundrum.

He was an absolute star for his Franchise and for the Boks.  He then became flakey and we signed him when he was out of favour in ZA and was playing poorly.  He was doing many of the same things he is doing now.  seeming to be impetuous, making ill-judged passes and putting his team and team mates in trouble.

Fast forward to today.  He played some blinding rugby for us in the past couple of seasons, as he did in ZA both for his Franchise and for the Boks when at the top of his game now is back to his bad self.

Who is the real WLR?  I think he has a kind of short attention span type problem and when things don't go his way he disintegrates. 

We lost JG through injury early in the season.  We had no leadership in the backs.  Yesterday was a prime example of losing control of a game through lack of leadership.  Once Launch had gone off we had no leadership in the forwards either.

Maybe next season we will have JG back to his best.  However we must identify a (more) leader(s) in the backs.

Miller, nice guy...
Bassett not really worth his place at the moment
JdJ not a leader but a grafter
Gaby off
Watson not a leader
Simpson off, thank God as past his best
Lima not based on anything I have seen so far
Robbo possibly if he plays again
Searle not got the "je ne said quoi"
Our new Italian unlikely
Fekitoa Possible but I fear not
Vellacott depends on Robbo
Bouj .....next

We need as a minimum a Fraser Waters (Brad Barrett for the EE) and ideally a Kinga, Umaga?

[Jac A]

Fats, I think you make some very good points.

I think you're question on WLR is in part answered by the second part. To me, WLR is a player who needs leadership and structure. That might seem odd for a player who is so mercurial and able to play in an unstructured way but I think it is precisely that that means he needs the structure. Without a framework and someone telling him what the plan is, he does his own thing which doesn't work on a team level. With some leadership on the pitch he is able to play to a system but use his flair and panache to create moments of magic.

There is also the difficult to argue against claim that he has not put the same defensive effort in this year as he did previously, maybe as he is now back in the international fold. Whatever it is he has only one more game for Wasps and while he probably won't be in the Hall of Fame, he has contributed to some very special moments and does seem like a totally decent bloke so I will wish him well at the end of the season.

Leadership though is key and is sorely lacking. Personably I think that a successful team needs 2/3 leaders in the pack and 2 in the backs. Agree entirely that 'back in the day' we had Shaw, Lol and Worsley and Kinga and Fraser in the backs. The previous couple of seasons we had Launch and Hask and Cips and Jimmy. This year, without Launch, nada.

In the pack Shields should be able to provide that and Jack Willis has the potential. Jamma seems like a good captain for communicating but I'm not sure about scruff of the neck, pulling the team along, talismanic leadership.

In the backs, it's hard to disagree with Fats assessment. As I have said elsewhere (and don't want to sound like a broken record), in NZ, Lima seemed to work best with the leadership of Aaron and Ben Smith plus Backman to some degree. That is not to say he is a poor player by any stretch, just that we need to find that 'grip' from somewhere else. 

[mike909]

The grumblings suggest that the team are telling the coaches that the 'plan' does not work, but the coaches are insisting that the fault lies with the players. So some players have gotten fed up and have disconnected. There needs to be a very frank discussion with senior players and coaches, where the players are not shot down, otherwise we could see a much worse year next year.

My experience of working inside organisations that have such issues is that it is almost always 90% the problem of management. That's where we need the clearout. The main squad coaches. Once you have lost the trust of the players, they will leave, and they have. Those you can replace. The management you must replace. Not saying that is Dai, but the guys under him have done a piss poor job this year.

As I noted elsewhere - I am writing a briefing for my professional body aimed at the "effective board" and two things stand out from the research and from my experience when thing go wrong ( in what seems to be the Wasps problem)

Firstly, the "board" (in our case coaches) fail to live the standards expected of the employees (players) and within board/employee engagement, the board fails to listen to those who are delivering the plan/services

Coaching trust is a fragile thing - and once lost is probably not coming back

The key thing for any move to the future (my personal opinion) is that if you are new - making changes for the sake of it is not the first priority - listening ought to be and taking a moment to review what is in place. Then look to take things forwards, stage by stage.  I've seen too many directors take the "new broom" approach and make things worse (my last employer, a case in point!)

[JonnyD]

A team where the sum of the parts are less and not more than the total.

There are some individuals on the team who don't buy into 'the plan'. WLR is one.

Given where we are, with one game left and little to play for other than pride and a home crowd that wants to see a TEAM playing, if I were Dai, I would mix it up for this last game. Let WLR have a 'rest', give Miller the FB position. Maybe give a couple of youngsters a start and see how they fare..

I completely agree but have said somewhere else on a board somewhere that I’m am 100% confident that this just won’t happen with Dai.
Whilst we mathematically have a chance of 6th or 7th (for the outside chance of qualifying for top tier Europe) I don’t see Dai bedding in Umaga et al.
Could be an excellent occasion, last game at the Ricoh, big crowd, start Porter, Umaga and Sirker on the bench maybe and say ‘go on lads, this could be yours if you want it, go and enjoy it.’
Instead I’m sure we’ll see Daly straight back in, WLR retained and everyone gets a good send off.

[Chunky24]

Think I read rumours of Theo Vukasinovic from London Scottish, second row, arriving next season, not the usual place to find rumours but "games for meaningful sanction" section of this red card report for him seems to confirm it.

https://www.englandrugby.com/mm/Document/Governance/Disclipine/01/33/34/07/VukasinovicLondonScottishJudgmentMay19(final)_English.pdf

[Neils]

So suspended before he even arrives.

[Rossm]

So suspended before he even arrives.

Better than being injured which is more usual for us.

[Vespula Vulgaris]

Plenty of folk saying we need an aggressive lock.  Looks like we might just have one.

[Heathen]

Talking of rumours, somewhere on FB I read that we are in discussion with KB to bring him back post RWC.