Predictions for Today

[baldpaul101]

I think people are being a bit simplistic in saying players only go to Sarries or stay at Sarries because they are getting paid well (whether legally or not).

Players who are interviewed, both Sarries players & players form other clubs ALL say that Sarries, irrespective of money, are a great club to play for. Nothing is too much trouble, the H&C is superb (think about how quickly injured Sarries players come back?), the club look after the families  & no detail is too small. Journalists all say the players themselves & the coaching team are approachable, polite & all round nice guys.
In short they behave like a proper rugby club in many respects.

I'm not saying they are adhering to the cap, but its clearly not just about the money (although I'm sure that must help a lot!)

[mike909]

Its not about the money...not sure anyone has said its just about the money. Its a genuine enquiry about how level a playing field we are playing on.

Andto have a "nothing is too much trouble" attitude and have everything in hand for H&C requires money

Its not simplistic, is it, to ask how within the salary cap is it stands, a Prem team can afford to employ around 8 Lions starters/bench players plus a number of overseas internationals?

That they have a good attitude is great. It is also about winning and success, but that success costs.

[baldpaul101]

but surely H&C, having enough coaches, looking after players families on game day etc is not covered by the cap?

Granted all those things become easier with money, my point was just having loads of money isn't enough to create what Sarries have created.
Being able to pay over the cap is going to be a big driver, but, as mentioned elsewhere, a lot of their current star player started their careers there and you wouldn't expect them to be leaving any time soon.

I think there is a lot of areas teams could improve on & close the gap on Sarries without breaking the cap.
Whether that would make enough of a difference or not, who knows.

[Rifleman Harris]

Agreed.  It's a bit like the Ineos cycling team under Sky.  They had more money than anyone else and that made the vast bulk of the difference between them and the other teams, but when the chips were down, the situation was tight it wasn't the fact that the riders were paid more than anyone else, it was those little differences which gave them the edge.  I think Sarries are the same. It is the sort of thing that the other teams should look at and replicate (if they can manage to replicate the way they stay under the salary cap, then they should do that too)! 

[NellyWellyWaspy]

Getting the back room 'right' is critical. The proposed new facilities at The Crofts will see the infrastruture for that, and I expect that they will be superior to what is on offer at Broadstreet. But that will not be until next summer. Then you need to staff it. That will be the hard part. Buying in talent at a price will not build a team. I sort of feel the same about coaches. They really should come from within. I can suspect that it is so at both Sarries and Chiefs.

[Lwasp]

And that, Rifleman, is the biggest risk to the sport I think. Yes, every club should offer the same facilities and behind the scenes care and opportunities as Sarries, but how? Sarries did it by racking up £50m+ in debts that got mostly written off when the Saffas walked away. The only way to match that is to find (b)millionaire owners of your own that don't mind losing that much.

As we are seeing with the Ricoh move, we are not yet self sustaining at our level of spending, and that's with an arena complex, hotel and casino supporting us. The revenues of our league do not support Sarries' level of spending. I do not want a sport solely reliant on a never ending conveyor belt of rich fools with nothing better to do with their money.

[mike909]

but surely H&C, having enough coaches, looking after players families on game day etc is not covered by the cap?

Granted all those things become easier with money, my point was just having loads of money isn't enough to create what Sarries have created.
Being able to pay over the cap is going to be a big driver, but, as mentioned elsewhere, a lot of their current star player started their careers there and you wouldn't expect them to be leaving any time soon.

I think there is a lot of areas teams could improve on & close the gap on Sarries without breaking the cap.
Whether that would make enough of a difference or not, who knows.

I agree with that - I was mixing two things - but as others have said - it still requires someone to underwrite those costs

But - they can be as nice a club as they like - but if they are paying to retain/attract players (Daly) and its salary cap plus undisclosed financial advantages only available to their players then either the regs need amending or we're in a Man City style free for all - when big bucks to players at least smooths the path to success

And my main gripe is that I want to see reasonably close games and whenever Sarries play their first team in the Prem, its very rarely close or that interesting

[baldpaul101]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/48436792

Obviously avoids any mention of impropriety but does help to show why Sarries are doing so well.
Plenty in there for other clubs to learn from!