Always a Wasp

Author Topic: Should we be worried by this?  (Read 2781 times)

Heathen

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andermt

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2020, 09:10:44 AM »
Looks like the Ricoh supporting an initiative to get help for music venues etc which are really struggling.

I don't think it is a worry for the Ricoh as although they hold concerts I wouldn't think they are make or break for Wasps.

Neils

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2020, 09:11:16 AM »
I would say so. Insurance cannot cover such a long delay.
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NellyWellyWaspy

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2020, 10:00:37 AM »
Given the withdrawal of support for furloughed staff, many entertainment venues will already have to take the decision to make those staff currently on furlough redundant. Once that happens, any recovery in that industry moves from months to decades, if ever. Most of those businesses will enter administration and, ultimately, go bust. Many will never reopen. They have no cash piles to contribute to the furlough scheme.

Many pubs and restaurants that have just reopened will realise that the reduced numbers they are allowed to cater to make those businesses uneconomic. I would be surprised if more than 10% of entertainment businesses survive to the end of this year. Sadly, that will see millions on the unemployment list. Having been there myself more than once, I know how hard that will be. Homelessness and poverty will soar. Banks will be facing massive levels of bad debt, compounded by the very much higher levels of rented property we now have, often financed and leveraged through mortgages. And so a property crash is on its way. In turn, that will take down a lot of construction companies, and so on. The crash of the 1920s will seem trivial.

These are truths no-one wants to recognise. I don't want it to be so. It will be horrible.

What can the government do? Not a lot. For as long as any form of lockdown exists, whether enforced (as it currently is) or voluntary (how many of you have actually gone to a pub this last weekend, ie voluntarily self isolated?). This virus has not gone away, and maybe never will. This is the new normal. Our society is predicated on capitalism, and that requires that the masses are gainfully employed and are spending. We have been cushioned by the vast sums of money spent by the government, but that gravy train is coming off the rails.

We face unprecedented times ahead, but no-one wants to talk about it, least of all politicians or 'the media'.

To an extent, you can see why Bolsonaro has not shut the economy down in Brazil. Yes, it has overloaded their health service, yes a LOT of people have died, but I suspect we cannot avoid that here either, albeit delayed somewhat compared to Brazil.

If we want our society to be as it was, then we have to accept the increased death levels and costs on our health service. Is their an equation? No. I heard a big debate on the radio this weekend on just that. At some point, someone has to be brave enough to say, it is what it is. Nothing we do will stop that. It just becomes another risk associated with living our lives, like cancer, accidents, etc.

But, it will take us, 'we, the people', a long time to realise this, because we are grasping at straws for a rescue plan. Vaccinations, more lockdown ... they won't stop this virus family. Pandora's box has been opened.

I would hope our politicians would just be truthful and say, 'this is how it is'.

Neils

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2020, 10:23:04 AM »
"I would hope our politicians would just be truthful and say, 'this is how it is'."

I would fully agree with this. Sad as it is this "me, me" culture we are in these days cannot keep being bailed by the government (ie me). Everything/everyone seems to think they are more important than the next person/organisation and so so deserving of free funding. Sadly the sooner things go bust the sooner the people concerned can, hopefully, seriously start to re-build their lives. That might even include places as big as the Ricoh!

God help us all when the next waves hit.

Bit nasty but realistic

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Heathen

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2020, 10:41:50 AM »
Effective vaccination is the key. Once a core vaccine structure has been developed, it can be modified y-o-y as the virus mutates, as with flu. This is one of the reasons that HMG want everyone over 50 to get the flu jab earlier this year, so that a potential flu wave does not coincide with a second wave of C19.

welsh wasp

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2020, 10:51:20 AM »
A lot of people in this country are already in the "only just surviving" category described by the first two contributors. The rest of us have averted our eyes to them - or come to the view that it is all their fault. And a lot of these people are the hidden heroes of the care sector who have survived on zero-hours contracts; some have died or contributed to the deaths of others in care homes because they "survived" on having several zero-hours contracts.
Is that how we want to continue? If not, then it requires the Government to take a lead in increasing taxes & spending. And making zero hours contracts illegal. Not sure that the Johnson government has the vision or the courage to go down those roads.

DGP Wasp

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2020, 11:16:16 AM »
I don't think it is a worry for the Ricoh as although they hold concerts I wouldn't think they are make or break for Wasps.

Exactly, the lack of concert revenue will be more than made up for with the rugby, hotel, casino, conference facilities etc!  Oh, hang on!!  ;)

westwaleswasp

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2020, 09:07:18 PM »
A lot of people in this country are already in the "only just surviving" category described by the first two contributors. The rest of us have averted our eyes to them - or come to the view that it is all their fault. And a lot of these people are the hidden heroes of the care sector who have survived on zero-hours contracts; some have died or contributed to the deaths of others in care homes because they "survived" on having several zero-hours contracts.
Is that how we want to continue? If not, then it requires the Government to take a lead in increasing taxes & spending. And making zero hours contracts illegal. Not sure that the Johnson government has the vision or the courage to go down those roads.

Agree with your sentiments, but you can't make zero hour contracts illegal, some people actually want that flexibility. My mother was a bank nurse on zero hours for twenty years, and wanted that flexibility to do 18 hours one week and zero the next with no penalty or let down for anyone on either side. It was all very short notice on either side, but that was the point.  The ability to say no a couple of days in advance was quite empowering, and not something she could get on a regular contract.
What we need is a way to make sure zero hours go to people  who want them, and not for those who don't, so they don't substitute for 'real jobs' but allow people like my mum to work as she pleased.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2020, 09:11:48 PM by westwaleswasp »

BG

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2020, 07:24:31 AM »
Did your mum have someone else bringing an income into the household?

JF

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2020, 12:21:01 PM »
Zero hours contracts which tie you exclusively to an employer are the problem.

I had a client who ran several care homes. Almost all staff were on what would be called zero-hours contracts but were more like "I work when I want to" contracts.

Wiltshire Wasp

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2020, 01:18:30 PM »
Zero hours contracts which tie you exclusively to an employer are the problem.

I had a client who ran several care homes. Almost all staff were on what would be called zero-hours contracts but were more like "I work when I want to" contracts.

I think that is how they should be used and in that format they are ideal for many.
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westwaleswasp

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2020, 04:02:23 PM »
Did your mum have someone else bringing an income into the household?

Yes, indeed. In the 70s my dad had two jobs, money was tight, the economy shot. From the 80s to the 00s I had grown up a bit, my dad had the major income, and my mum had a non exclusive zero hours contract. She could work  for others if she wanted, but generally did not. It was a 'work when you want' arrangement and enabled her to work in a number of different clinics which she enjoyed. If she had been on a set 15, 20, 25, 30 etc.  hour contract she would have not done it.
The point is the zero hour contract as a primary income or substitute for a real, regular job is the issue, for students and people with other lives who want to do a bit on the side or gain experience in a shop for the CV they are fine.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2020, 04:05:37 PM by westwaleswasp »

welsh wasp

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Re: Should we be worried by this?
« Reply #13 on: July 09, 2020, 11:28:56 AM »
I agree with the comments that some people want the flexibility to make a choice about when they work. But I also agree with the comments that zero hours contracts have become the "no choice" situation for many people in low-skill jobs - the Amazon driver; the cleaner; the worker in a care home; etc. And the lack of security plus low pay plus no sick pay means that too many people working in these areas who have felt ill or actually caught the virus have been faced with no option but to carry on working. We now acknowledge that care workers are key workers - so we need to treat them as such.