England

[Skippy]

Having picked Youngs, there's probably no point in picking Willis. All his turnovers would just be wasted by the ponderous Ben Youngs, either through slow distribution or a simple coughing up of possession.

I think we can expect to see an overly regimented, overly planned game from England. Again.

[mike909]

They've only been in camp for a few days. I'm not at all surprised that most the Wasps boys aren't involved.

Seems the Exeter players including an uncapped SR were ok though?

Unambitious selection that suggests England's future will be likely rather predictable and unexciting

Furbank wouldn't make most Prem teams on recent form, Youngs is not anyone's idea of the future and including Billy at 8 just slows down the pack and makes England even more predicable. I know centres are less specialist these days, but Slade has always looks a good 13 for Exeter, outside one of three "robust" 12's and JJ really needs to start looking like the player he was in the past.

Watson yet again, wasted at wing and if you are going to get Thorley on the pitch, why not from the start as he is likely to have a future for England. But this just suggests we're waiting on Daly for 15 again.

And Farrell at 10 reduces the ability to improvise and there is no obvious replacement for injury or not playing well (prob not important for Eddie)

Jeez - this sort of dull selection is why I enjoy watching the ups and down of the other 6N's team than watching England any more. PRobably just me.....

[Raggs]

They've only been in camp for a few days. I'm not at all surprised that most the Wasps boys aren't involved.

Seems the Exeter players including an uncapped SR were ok though?

Unambitious selection that suggests England's future will be likely rather predictable and unexciting

Furbank wouldn't make most Prem teams on recent form, Youngs is not anyone's idea of the future and including Billy at 8 just slows down the pack and makes England even more predicable. I know centres are less specialist these days, but Slade has always looks a good 13 for Exeter, outside one of three "robust" 12's and JJ really needs to start looking like the player he was in the past.

Watson yet again, wasted at wing and if you are going to get Thorley on the pitch, why not from the start as he is likely to have a future for England. But this just suggests we're waiting on Daly for 15 again.

And Farrell at 10 reduces the ability to improvise and there is no obvious replacement for injury or not playing well (prob not important for Eddie)

Jeez - this sort of dull selection is why I enjoy watching the ups and down of the other 6N's team than watching England any more. PRobably just me.....

Johnny Hill has been in England camps before though.

Furbank is a good player, maybe he's worth persevering with, maybe he isn't, I probably wouldn't have chosen him again, but at the same time, are you going to destroy his confidence completely now if you drop him. Youngs I agree, but we have no other options who've played at the level and been in camp, that's down to Eddie, but there's no one else to pick for Italy at the moment.

Billy is a world class 8, even in his poorer games he's a very solid selection.

JJ has been looking good recently. He no longer tries to do it all on his own, and uses his handling a lot more now, which is only a positive. He's also exceptional in defence, which is probably handy to have if you're putting Slade in a less familiar position. And again, who else are you picking?

Ford is broken, are you going to put an untested 10 in? I'd rather Farrell at 10 than 12, especially as he has another couple of distributers in Slade and Furbank around him.

Watson is not a distributor at 15, which is clearly what Eddie is after, but he's far from wasted on the wing!

[backdoc]

Whatever Eddie wants at 15, Furbank couldn't distribute a Xmas present to his mother at the moment.

[Raggs]

Whatever Eddie wants at 15, Furbank couldn't distribute a Xmas present to his mother at the moment.

He's had a rough run at club level, but he has shown class in the past. Is he worth sticking with? Let's hope so. If you've decided on a pattern of play, then there's more use in testing out a young player who has potential, than changing the system for a game (or playing someone who doesn't fit the system).

[Hymenoptera]

They've only been in camp for a few days. I'm not at all surprised that most the Wasps boys aren't involved.

Seems the Exeter players including an uncapped SR were ok though?

Unambitious selection that suggests England's future will be likely rather predictable and unexciting

Furbank wouldn't make most Prem teams on recent form, Youngs is not anyone's idea of the future and including Billy at 8 just slows down the pack and makes England even more predicable. I know centres are less specialist these days, but Slade has always looks a good 13 for Exeter, outside one of three "robust" 12's and JJ really needs to start looking like the player he was in the past.

Watson yet again, wasted at wing and if you are going to get Thorley on the pitch, why not from the start as he is likely to have a future for England. But this just suggests we're waiting on Daly for 15 again.

And Farrell at 10 reduces the ability to improvise and there is no obvious replacement for injury or not playing well (prob not important for Eddie)

Jeez - this sort of dull selection is why I enjoy watching the ups and down of the other 6N's team than watching England any more. PRobably just me.....

Johnny Hill has been in England camps before though.


Furbank is a good player, maybe he's worth persevering with, maybe he isn't, I probably wouldn't have chosen him again, but at the same time, are you going to destroy his confidence completely now if you drop him. Youngs I agree, but we have no other options who've played at the level and been in camp, that's down to Eddie, but there's no one else to pick for Italy at the moment.

Billy is a world class 8, even in his poorer games he's a very solid selection.

JJ has been looking good recently. He no longer tries to do it all on his own, and uses his handling a lot more now, which is only a positive. He's also exceptional in defence, which is probably handy to have if you're putting Slade in a less familiar position. And again, who else are you picking?

Ford is broken, are you going to put an untested 10 in? I'd rather Farrell at 10 than 12, especially as he has another couple of distributers in Slade and Furbank around him.

Watson is not a distributor at 15, which is clearly what Eddie is after, but he's far from wasted on the wing!

Furbank is a good player based on what? - He's been shocking for Saints all season and looked average for Eng x 2. How about the confidence of players that are performing and get no recognition, works both ways. Malins is in a different league to Furbank, as is Thorley.
JJ has offered Bath very little for the last couple of seasons, noted by most Bath supporters. I can't remember the last time he made a break...good defender for sure, something you don't really need against Italy.

EJ is a bare faced liar. He said stated they are always seeking better players than what they have and pick on form, neither of which is true, the closest he gets is naming better players but they never get the opportunity because he isn't a good enough coach to bridge the gap between experience and form. My dog could have guessed this team

Remember who the opposition is, if new players dont get exposed to weak opposition they will never get a shot against half decent ones, injuries aside.

[mike909]

Whatever Eddie wants at 15, Furbank couldn't distribute a Xmas present to his mother at the moment.

He's had a rough run at club level, but he has shown class in the past. Is he worth sticking with? Let's hope so. If you've decided on a pattern of play, then there's more use in testing out a young player who has potential, than changing the system for a game (or playing someone who doesn't fit the system).

I'll agree to disagree with your post post! For me, England are going into a game selecting three regular 13's, no 12 except the 10, no spare 10 and a pensionable 9. As for Furbank - I'd have expected most coaches to have told him he is still in England's plans - realise he's been under pressure for form and perhaps some games in the Prem would be good, rather than being selected, out of form, for an international match? I do think JJ is not hitting the highs of before - and I really like him as a player - and Watson is a great winger - but if you are aiming as England do for a distributing 12 (hence Slade, I presume, in for Farrell) another distributor at 15 is a bit of a luxury when it comes at the cost of tackling/positioning ability - or this week, form.

I think Billy and indeed Mako are the sort of forwards who will become less relevant as the game becomes faster, and more turnover orientated. Playing Billy tells us nothing we don't know already - and the opposition know - just like we did vs Sarries - that his one trick is predictable and a turnover opportunity. Sure, I'd not want to tackle him, but I'm pretty sure he won't try to run into space or link with the backs., and as a pro I'd be confident of bringing him down.

[DGP Wasp]

Does Eddie do this just to wind everyone up?

If so it works....

Works for me. Nothing surprises me with Eddie any more, but I am no less baffled.

[westwaleswasp]

Because Eddie has stated that club form not relevant, he can never be proved wrong as he selects on something other than how well players have played for their clubs, and he won't say what that is beyond his gut and 'combinations', the latter of which is what all coaches are looking for.

Many said he was a short term coach, and it looks increasingly like they were right. A record 8 losses in 9, wasn't it and worst 6n performance ever was a low point, and although we have been on an upswing since, finishing second in a WC is only the same as Brian Ashton's 2007 England. Bomber's England also mugged NZ and often beat a better Aussie team than the current vintage.  Really those two post WC years of 6n success and superb Australia tour bought Eddie  lot of credit, but I feel he really needs a title soon. The media will be quick to give him a kicking if results sour.


Remember, Eddie is working with lots of players who at junior level won the lot with England, and our resources are plentiful in terms of players......

[Shugs]

Not sure how Furbank gets picked as others say. I just think he's average. It may be controversial but I think Billy Vunipola is a busted flush at 8. Massively one dimensional and there are a few I would select at 8 ahead of him now.

[backdoc]

Agree Shugs.

I cannot see Billy V continuing as an effective England player because [1] he is injured the whole time [2] his skill set is looking out of date.

I think most players have a limited amount of top level games in them, which brings into question Mako V. Some players are not limited in this way, but when the primary function of the position at No. 1 is their weakness, it does not look good for Mako in the long term. [Apologies: I have been watching a lot of Rumpole in the last few months.]

I am astonished that Joe L's all-court rugby game is overlooked after his recent performances, particularly after a career of 60 or so England caps. Is the game against Italy the one to blood Hill?

Youngs last notable contribution to a game was to be yellow carded 2 minutes into the Wasps game which contributed to a savage loss for Tigers. WTF.

To stick with the tried and trusted back row combination is the most conservative choice of all by Eddie. Bringing in a red-hot player carries little risk.

I struggle to bring the enthusiasm to watch the game on Saturday. My instincts say watch France v Ireland instead.

I don't think Eddie understands the relationship between his selection of an England team and whether anyone wants to watch them play.

[coddy]

Like nearly everyone else on this board has alluded to it is a very uninspiring squad.

Hopefully EJ will be more imaginative and reward form once this tournament is over and a new one begins a fortnight later.

[WaspsUpNorth]

The EJiot is now talking about Youngs getting 150 caps - if that's the case I'm changing nationalities, I'm sure I've got some Irish or Scottish ancestors. I went to Uni in Caerdydd, wonder if that counts?

[WonkyWasp]

I'm  English, but I shout  for Wales right now. Mind you, it hasn't helped them much.

[Raggs]

Just to be clear, I don't agree with everything Eddie does, but the guy has the best winning % of an English head coach. He got us to a final of a world cup 1 cycle after not even making the play offs, won a grand slam (after not even making the playoffs), a 6 nations, potentially another this weekend, matched the record number of consecutive wins for a tier 1 nation, whitewashed the aussies at home etc etc...

Who exactly are we expecting to replace him with and being confident in them to do better?