Daily Mail article re: 14 team premiership

[BG]

Another big question mark over this would be Ealing's financial viability. 

Mike Gooley (aka Trailfinders), the owner, is worth around £400M. He is quoted as saying that he would invest whatever is needed, to secure a place for Ealing at the top table.

But Trailfinders cannot possibly be worth that kind of money in the present environment.  He may have been worth £400m at the start of this year when we were all still merrily booking our holidays, but that valuation has probably dropped off a cliff in the past 8 months.  Hardly solid foundations for a Premiership rugby club.  I have a soft spot for Ealing as I lived there for many years, at one time just a stone's throw from the Trailfinders sports ground.  I would hate to see them bite off more that they can chew and a wealthy owner's ego and ambition see them go the way of London Welsh.  I may be doing Gooley a disservice, but professional rugby clubs are loss making businesses, as are most travel firms at the moment.  Not a good position to be in.

Looking at Companies House, Trailfinders seems to be another web of companies. It seems he has 75% or more stock of 1 company.. via another company. I'm guessing his "worth" is valued by his 75% at a given time of trading (18 - 24 months ago). Like you say.. what's that worth now? Do travel companies own assets?

Changing the subject slightly.. their offices are in Earls Court. My first skiing holiday started there.. 1989. We (loosely connected friends from uni . . well it was a poly back then) took  a coach from Earls Court to Andorra.. only 30 hrs or something ( ) . I have a feeling it was Trailfinders.

Having promised myself I'd never do the same thing again.. glutton for punishment... I did, but closer that next time.. Trois Vallees in the Alps.

Back to rugby - to ringfence the EPL I don't see the need for 14 clubs (possibly bankrupting Ealing).. stick to 13 and 1 club has 1 week-end off every round?

[Covkid48]

problem with a 13 team league is the last fixture of the season, for example the season just gone if Sale had finished their season and had no game on the last day and could finish no better than 5th, then both Bath and Bristol could play 3rd teams and rest players for the semi's

[Wiltshire Wasp]

If there is ring fencing do we need play offs?

[Rifleman Harris]

Definitely, possible expanded to 8 teams, otherwise the league would be meaningless after a few rounds...or manipulatable.  Imagine Exeter (without the cheats); the season could easily be meaningless after a few rounds, or during the international periods the skew on the impacts on various squads could make the league meaningless.  Also, imagine if the Cheats were challenging Exeter then sides could put out weakened sides vs Exeter and full sides against the cheats (highly unprofessional, but possible).  Keeping the playoffs would keep more teams interested.

[Trevs Big Tackle]

Is the plan to stop relegation forever or just for next season to facilitate the increase from 12 to 14? Because there's no reason a 14 team league couldn't have relegation. Even if it's split into 2 divisions there could be a relegation playoff between the bottom team of each division. That even increases the number of teams battling relegation so reduces the number of 'meaningless games' fans and broadcasters are worried about.

[hopwood]

As soon as the threat of relegation disappeared last season, Wasps started playing the best rugby they have played in years.
Maybe a coincidence, maybe not.

Questions:

Does relegation blunt teams' ability to be creative and more attack-minded?

And does this (playing it safer) impact on the evolution of English rugby as a whole?

[wasps]

As soon as the threat of relegation disappeared last season, Wasps started playing the best rugby they have played in years.
Maybe a coincidence, maybe not.

Questions:

Does relegation blunt teams' ability to be creative and more attack-minded?

And does this (playing it safer) impact on the evolution of English rugby as a whole?

I have no idea
But did any other team near the bottom start playing fantastic rugby once the threat of relegation disappeared?

[Hymenoptera]

As soon as the threat of relegation disappeared last season, Wasps started playing the best rugby they have played in years.
Maybe a coincidence, maybe not.

Questions:

Does relegation blunt teams' ability to be creative and more attack-minded?

And does this (playing it safer) impact on the evolution of English rugby as a whole?

I have no idea
But did any other team near the bottom start playing fantastic rugby once the threat of relegation disappeared?

Agree, and I lost count of the amount of games I zoned out of due to uncompetitiveness.
More worryingly it scews the league. Imagine, you play Glaws early in the season and lose to their first team. Towards the end of the season when they have nothing to play for they field a weak side against your rivals, who get 5 points and knock you out of the playoffs. Ringfencing removes integrity, you could become champions through the fixtures schedule alone.

[hopwood]

As soon as the threat of relegation disappeared last season, Wasps started playing the best rugby they have played in years.
Maybe a coincidence, maybe not.

Questions:

Does relegation blunt teams' ability to be creative and more attack-minded?

And does this (playing it safer) impact on the evolution of English rugby as a whole?

I have no idea
But did any other team near the bottom start playing fantastic rugby once the threat of relegation disappeared?

Agree, and I lost count of the amount of games I zoned out of due to uncompetitiveness.
More worryingly it scews the league. Imagine, you play Glaws early in the season and lose to their first team. Towards the end of the season when they have nothing to play for they field a weak side against your rivals, who get 5 points and knock you out of the playoffs. Ringfencing removes integrity, you could become champions through the fixtures schedule alone.

I hear you.

[Bloke in North Dorset]

A 14 club Premiership gives 26 matches per club. That would almost certainly kick out any other competition than the Euros. Unless of course the awful conference system is adopted. Max then is 12 + 3 matches for the finalists. Clubs would certainly not like losing the revenue from at least 5 home games a season.

It also means more games during internationals with all the downsides - lost players, lower crowds etc.

More importantly a bigger player welfare issue:

More games means more injuries, through just being tired and parts of the body giving up, or the usual rugby injuries. This means bigger squads.

Or the same number of games for players and bigger squads.

In both those cases either the salary cap needs to be increased or players take pay cts. No need to go in to those problems on here.

[bigad82]

Isn't this just the Cheaters doing a bit of fishing?

[FrankWasp]

Bl**dy hope so!

[Covkid48]

This is a no win situation. if the Championship is cancelled how can you promote a team or teams without creating havoc with the other teams in that league? if we don't have relegation and promotion BT want a wedge of their cash back. i'd like nothing more than to see the EA's spend two seasons out of the premiership but can't see it being allowed to happen. if we did end up with a 14 team league would it be such a bad thing? two extra home fixtures with the extra cash that brings and would mean clubs would need to use their full squad and develop their youth (didn't do us any harm this season), if these fixtures replaced the domestic cup games i'd be happy enough.

[hookender]

If Premiership were to go to 14 teams would there be extra places in Euro challenge cup?

So incentive for clubs ,if ring fenced, would be not to finish bottom two.

[Covkid48]

I don't see how you can have a truly competitive league without relegation and promotion. Teams like Worcester, Irish and Leicester could give up if with 5 games to go they couldn't improve their position and could play weakened teams blooding new young players in preparation for the following season so giving teams they play an advantage, the play offs could end up being decided by the fixture list.