Wasps make full back their number one transfer priority

[Shugs]

Completely agree Wombles. Full back is definitely a pivotal position and attack wise it is maybe the one on the pitch which allows the most scope/creativity/invention. Defence wise it can lose you a game quickly if not done right. That’s why I’m constantly bemused that it is seen as a position for experimentation. For me the “doesn’t matter what number is on your back” is just mad.

[mike909]

Yep - I'm also one for generally keeping players in their familiar positions. There are good examples of cross over - wing and FB from our own Mr Lewsey back in the day but it's like with England, the obsession with playing centres out of position and the world's slowest back three because Furbank "can do it all".....But the so called utility back is more of an excuse not to make a decision......

[Bloke in North Dorset]

If you're having problems at FB I can see why you might want to try out a winger, they're used to dropping back and fielding high balls. I can also see why you'd want to try out a 10, they give a good attacking option and are usually good kicking ball out of hand are being cool under pressure.

The question is, is this better or worse than giving you're existing full backs the opportunity to get them selves back in to form during crucial matches?

I don't know the answer to that and only the coaches know what's going on in the minds of players and how they preform in training so we have to go with their judgment, its what they get paid to do.

What I do know, this is another reason, on top of long term injured players getting match fit, for a return of an A league or something similar.

[NellyWellyWaspy]

I have a theory that the most experienced member of the coaching team has looked over the squad and picked out those that he feels are not top level Premiership players, and the other coaches have deferred to him. Those players then become deadwood in the squad.

+1

It isn't a matter of them not wanting to leave. We may not want them to stay. Some must be out of contract, so I would guess those will not have been offered a new contract. Those who have another year left, may be given help and an incentive to leave. With only one marquee now allowed, and a much limited cap, plus a need for a deep squad, you cannot carry deadwood (to paraphrase backdoc).

[Hymenoptera]

Unless the position has changed, isn't a #1 pre-req of being a 15 having the ability to catch a ball? That being the case, we currently have no 15's in the squad.
I used to think Mike Brown was a dull 15 because all he could really do was catch...now I'd give anything to have him for a season or 2 (as per Shugs).

[wasps]

This forum is always joking about trying Alfie at 12.
But more seriously often suggesting, Jacob or Charlie at 12, Odogwu at 13, and probably some others I can't think of.


We've actually seen Bassett at 13, MLB and Fekitoa playing 12 or 13, Miller at 10 and 12, Oghre at 7, and many other unusual positions.




So many positions require comparable skills where a good player can move
Also, with younger players, they'll have often recently played other positions before breaking into the first team
And older players may have the intelligence and experience to adapt their skills to various positions too




Is playing Jacob at 15 as ridiculous as Oghre at 7?


Odogwu had some very good games at 13 that brought him onto the England radar, however, before that he was a winger that looked like he might have quick feet and some power, but he's now considered a winger / outside centre.


You only find that by trying players out in positions where their skills might translate....... But with so few dead rubber games these days it's incredibly difficult for a coach to try that.

[Hymenoptera]

This forum is always joking about trying Alfie at 12.
But more seriously often suggesting, Jacob or Charlie at 12, Odogwu at 13, and probably some others I can't think of.


We've actually seen Bassett at 13, MLB and Fekitoa playing 12 or 13, Miller at 10 and 12, Oghre at 7, and many other unusual positions.




So many positions require comparable skills where a good player can move
Also, with younger players, they'll have often recently played other positions before breaking into the first team
And older players may have the intelligence and experience to adapt their skills to various positions too




Is playing Jacob at 15 as ridiculous as Oghre at 7?


Odogwu had some very good games at 13 that brought him onto the England radar, however, before that he was a winger that looked like he might have quick feet and some power, but he's now considered a winger / outside centre.


You only find that by trying players out in positions where their skills might translate....... But with so few dead rubber games these days it's incredibly difficult for a coach to try that.

Firstly, whats with the paragraph breaks?
Ogre at 7 was the only one that kind of worked. For me Dog is not and will never be a FT 13...evvvveeerrrr.
No issue with Jacob at 15, if he improves the core skills, that's where a Mike brown would do wonders.

[wasps]

No idea why I do paragraphs like that on my phone. I don't do it on the computer.
Probably some deep rooted psychological reason


Anyway, I suppose the real question is, was it right to even try Odogwu at 13?
We were struggling with injuries, and I believe MLB had filled in there too.
While Odogwu has some weaknesses in his game, it's undeniable that he brings some power and quick feet, and he always looks like a lot is happening, even if it isn't. He had a run of games where he was breaking the defensive line time and again which will always catch the eye.
Once a player does that, I can see why you'd continue to try them in the position.
Can a player learn a position in a dozen games? Almost certainly not, but hopefully a coach with an eye for talent should be able to see if a player has future there.

[Shugs]

Maybe trying all those players in different positions is why outbacks have looked so disjointed. Some of it was necessity but some wasn’t.

[Hymenoptera]

No idea why I do paragraphs like that on my phone. I don't do it on the computer.
Probably some deep rooted psychological reason


Anyway, I suppose the real question is, was it right to even try Odogwu at 13?
We were struggling with injuries, and I believe MLB had filled in there too.
While Odogwu has some weaknesses in his game, it's undeniable that he brings some power and quick feet, and he always looks like a lot is happening, even if it isn't. He had a run of games where he was breaking the defensive line time and again which will always catch the eye.
Once a player does that, I can see why you'd continue to try them in the position.
Can a player learn a position in a dozen games? Almost certainly not, but hopefully a coach with an eye for talent should be able to see if a player has future there.

Dog's lack of distribution is the main reason he can't be a 13 for me, it's actually limiting our game by having him at 13 for that reason. His attributes don't tip the scale enough to the positive. Anyway,,we need a 15..back on subject. Mike...give us a call

[wasps]

I don't know that I'd completely rule him out based on lack of distribution.
While our wingers are of average quality not passing to then probably doesn't hurt as much as it otherwise would.


His highlight performances typically came from running good supporting lines which is a key skill for both a winger and an outside centre.
Power and footwork are handy, but it's crucial to get the defensive positioning right, and that comes with training and experience.






As for Brown at full back, I can certainly see where he'd benefit us, but he's the wrong player to be championing when you're criticising someone else's lack of distribution in the same post

[welsh wasp]

Backdoc: any reason why you, & presumably others, avoided using Mitchell’s names our “most senior coach”? We all worked it out.
Ad there is a common view that the key positions are 2, 8, 9, 10 & 15. We are OK with the first three but uncertain about the last two.
We seem to have been trialling different players at 10 & 15 by selecting them for different games.

[Egret]

If you're having problems at FB I can see why you might want to try out a winger, they're used to dropping back and fielding high balls. I can also see why you'd want to try out a 10, they give a good attacking option and are usually good kicking ball out of hand are being cool under pressure.

I guess this is only me but I first read this paragraph as "...dropping balls and fielding high backs....."

[backdoc]

Backdoc: any reason why you, & presumably others, avoided using Mitchell’s names our “most senior coach”? We all worked it out.
Ad there is a common view that the key positions are 2, 8, 9, 10 & 15. We are OK with the first three but uncertain about the last two.
We seem to have been trialling different players at 10 & 15 by selecting them for different games.

Simply highlighting his seniority - all the rest are under 40 and are still 'learning'.

[Bloke in North Dorset]

Unless the position has changed, isn't a #1 pre-req of being a 15 having the ability to catch a ball? That being the case, we currently have no 15's in the squad.
I used to think Mike Brown was a dull 15 because all he could really do was catch...now I'd give anything to have him for a season or 2 (as per Shugs).

I wish I had £1 for every time I screamed "pass the ######## thing" at the TV when Mike Brown was playing for England.

That said, I agree. We need something solid at the back and his sheer grit would be nice to have around the team.