Always a Wasp

Author Topic: England players non availability  (Read 2616 times)

JonnyD

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #15 on: July 20, 2022, 10:33:53 PM »
I don't have an issue with the internationals or overlap with the prem, it gives new players their chance and deepens the pool, it also increases the value of the journeymen.

I have an issue with 'random release', e.g. Marler gets released but Launch gets told to stay. That is bullshit and needs to stop, now and forever.
Eddie should not be able to release selected players mid tournament- either they all get released or none. The pre tournament camps can do one too.

I also have an issue with compulsory rest, which does not seem to take in individual circumstances.

That Launchbury incident, followed by him saying he was injured for the following training camp but then turned out for wasps the following weekend in the run in to the season seems to have been his end with Eddie.

westwaleswasp

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2022, 06:44:33 PM »
It is looking like that now.
Mind you, it is Eddie. He falls out with everyone eventually, apart from Haskell!


Shugs

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #17 on: July 22, 2022, 10:01:48 AM »
I’d be surprised if Launchbury doesn’t get back in. England’s depth at lock isn’t overly impressive for me.

baldpaul101

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #18 on: July 25, 2022, 11:20:12 AM »
The International game & the prem cannot exist without the other.
At the moment both sides understand this, but if one side starts thinking they can go it alone, it could get very messy.


westwaleswasp

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2022, 12:31:04 PM »
I’d be surprised if Launchbury doesn’t get back in. England’s depth at lock isn’t overly impressive for me.
To be fair England's wing stock was not deep 2016, and Eddie ignored the most lethal wing in the northern hemisphere. Eddie will sometimes come crawling back to some- ask Danny Care- but only when the wheels are off and the chariot is deep in horse shit and sinking  as per 2022.

Peej

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #20 on: July 26, 2022, 03:40:22 PM »
For me the big thing should be suspending the domestic season when the internationals are on - as the French do. It's only for money that the clubs don't. Or they should play the whole Prem Cup/A team/Academy tournament across 8 weeks in November and Feb/March.

Heathen

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #21 on: July 26, 2022, 04:41:21 PM »
For me the big thing should be suspending the domestic season when the internationals are on - as the French do. It's only for money that the clubs don't. Or they should play the whole Prem Cup/A team/Academy tournament across 8 weeks in November and Feb/March.

It is interesting in that French sides play 26 league games, min 4 Euros. No domestic cups.

The Premiership is 24 league games, min 4 Euros and the PRC. IMHO the PRC sure be a purely for the Development squads/players returning from injury.

The French season starts earlier and finishes later that the Prem.

Shugs

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #22 on: July 26, 2022, 06:12:39 PM »
Spot on. The domestic league should close for internationals.

JonnyD

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #23 on: July 27, 2022, 07:59:18 AM »
The benefit the French now have is the strength of their lower divisions, so the top clubs can play fewer games, without a domestic cup, but the youngsters coming through and the late bloomers are still getting quality gametime.

With the absence of the A League the cup games are massive for the academy lads and squad players - we can’t lose that but perhaps playing the matches in two blocks would be more helpful for player development and loan clubs as the rest of the time players know they can play at a championship club for a set block of time.

The flip side of the lack of international break at present is that it becomes a bit of a leveller for the Premiership. The weaker teams tend to have fewer internationals away and therefore generally have a stronger team available to them in comparison to a Leicester or a Sarries. We’ve had some good fortune against bigger teams during the six nations in recent years.

Tricky decision as it’s a fine line between nurturing young players through whilst also the right a club should have in having their players available to them.
Maybe central contracts are the way forwards, wouldn’t work under Jones’ pebble dash selection policy but something needs to be done as we’re not getting it right at the moment I’m England.

Bloke in North Dorset

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #24 on: July 27, 2022, 10:28:25 AM »
Won’t international players still have to take a number of games off to manage their playing time, same as they do after a England tours?

Heathen

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #25 on: July 27, 2022, 12:20:05 PM »
Won’t international players still have to take a number of games off to manage their playing time, same as they do after a England tours?

Yes - the detail is in one of the posts on here giving how many rounds of GP matches they will be unavailable for. It is either 11 or 13 out of the 24.

Bloke in North Dorset

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #26 on: July 27, 2022, 02:14:05 PM »
Won’t international players still have to take a number of games off to manage their playing time, same as they do after a England tours?

Yes - the detail is in one of the posts on here giving how many rounds of GP matches they will be unavailable for. It is either 11 or 13 out of the 24.
My badly made point was that even if they arrange for no Prem games in the AI and 6N windows we still lose players for a lot of games. 

Mellie

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #27 on: July 27, 2022, 02:30:00 PM »
My badly made point was that even if they arrange for no Prem games in the AI and 6N windows we still lose players for a lot of games.
... but far fewer than if they are missing for international periods too.

All players need rest and recovery periods, so squad rotation is always required, even for non international players. However, if your best players are missing a lot then there's less room for your best backup players to get any R&R and covering injuries becomes extremely difficult.

A way of structuring the season has been required for years to ensure clubs and players aren't screwed by the system.

RogerE

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #28 on: July 27, 2022, 04:33:57 PM »
If they decided to  do what the French do, and not play Premiership games over International period, then they could just have a straight forward league, with none of the playoff and final nonsence.

Heathen

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Re: England players non availability
« Reply #29 on: July 27, 2022, 06:53:58 PM »
If they decided to  do what the French do, and not play Premiership games over International period, then they could just have a straight forward league, with none of the playoff and final nonsence.

The French do have play offs - 3 weeks worth .

QFs :3 v 6 and 4 v 5.

SFs : 1 plays winner of 4 v 5 and 2 plays winner 3 v 6

Final : winners of SFs meet at SdF.