English rugby fading

[Heathen]

See the thread about why the game is thriving in France.

The idea of Summer rugby has merit, but the entire structure of pro rugby in England needs tearing down and rebuilding. The RFU is unfit for purpose, and the club v country situation with the PRL is designed to weaken both clubs and the national side.

The RFU has not been fit for purpose ever since the game turned professional in 1995.

The abyss has grows wider every year.

[Skippy]

The RFU is about as fit for purpose at the CBI. Both are relics from a bygone era.

[Egret]

For the ignorant  (ie: me)  how does anyone get selected to be on  the RFU?  Friends?  Pl d  boys/farts  network?  Just  curiosity. Not that I'm thinking  of applying.

It used to be, and probably still is, that RFU Council members were nominated by each individual county, so Bucks, Berks, Ox, Warks, Worcs etc would nominate a council member each. These would have been through and through community rugby people, each one having been elected as a council member by the clubs in that county, and were the 57 old farts Will Carling referred to.

According to Camquin in the other place, a modernization of the RFU's decision making process resulted in all the power effectively given to the RFU executive with the Council rubber stamping their decisions. It was the Executive that dilly dallied at the start of the professional era and ceded control of the Premier League to PRL and the rest is history.

Now this is a sentence I did not expect to write - if this history is correct, the Blazers are not to blame....

[Heathen]

Indeed.

The county reps at HQ tended to be long standing members of that county, having served as chairmen, VPs, Presidents of their county.

I knew one guy particularly well - Peter Trunkfied. Peter was a great guy. Very dry sense of humour. I had the priviledge of playing alongside Peter a fews times. He was president of my club - Marlow. Was Bucks President and ultimately President of the RFU in 1998/9.

He was president when our beloved LBND was victim of the tabloid sting.

The county reps do some good stuff for the good of the amateur game.

The executive however, have not got a clue about developing the best blueprint for the professional game at both club and international level.

[baldpaul101]

All of this ignores the fact that Women's rugby in England, governed by the same RFU is thriving & leading the way in professionalism & innovation.
I know its a very different game & there's no powerful club structure or rich patrons to argue with, but it does show what can be done!

[Neils]

Women's rugby isn't the plaything of sugar daddy owners (ie the PRL) - yet!

[Marlovian]

Unfortunately I think it is. A minimum requirement in the new tender process included developing a professional coaching resource to support players in training throughout the week so just look at some the teams for 23/24: Bristol Bears Women, Exeter Rugby Club, Ealing Trainfinders Women, Gloucester-Hartpury Women?s RFC , Harlequins FC, Leicester Tigers, Loughborough Lightning/Northampton Saints, Sale Women, Saracens. Worcester are the odd ones out.

[andermt]

All of this ignores the fact that Women's rugby in England, governed by the same RFU is thriving & leading the way in professionalism & innovation.
I know its a very different game & there's no powerful club structure or rich patrons to argue with, but it does show what can be done!

Isn't that the one thing they have learned from the way they, to quote Egret, 'dilly dallied' when the men went professional, by getting in 1st with the women going pro.

It's obvious when you look at the difference between the home nations that the professionalism that has existed for a number of years in England is very much lacking in the others.

[andermt]

I would be interested in hearing some comment from those who were arguing that no relegation would "free teams up to play exciting rugby" & other such fanciful nonsense. Quite a few on here were of that opinion, wonder if any will own up?

I'll admit I was on the fence about the ring-fencing (sorry wasn't deliberate), but the situation that was being discussed at the time is very different to what it is today.

At that point it was currently a 13 team Premiership expanding to 14 with, very probably Ealing, who were about the only team in the Championship interested. If you look at the top half at the end of this season, Jersey, Ealing, Coventry, Bedford, Pirates & Doncaster, only 2 of them applied for approval for stadiums to move to the Prem, Ealing and Doncaster. Given the opportunity I'd guess Pirates would like to move up and possibly Hartpury but of the rest of the league I'm not sure there is much interest.

That 14 team league is a very different prospect to the 11, possibly 10 team league (or less) that is now the status. Again not saying I wanted a closed league but I could see some rational, for me that rational has gone with the demise of Wasps and Worcester, the fact they won't approve Ealing to get promoted means it would potentially be a much weaker league.
Something I think has been proved out by the completely pointless final round and the big disadvantage that Saints now have of not playing any rugby for weeks.