Always a Wasp
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1
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Another One??
« on: March 29, 2023, 11:54:04 AM »
WWW has this thing about London and it's a broken record. But look what happened in the wastelands of Coventry. London will work if the stadium is the right size, and transport links. The Stoop is the perfect example for both. Full house for most games. Great atmosphere. For those of us who have travelled to Sarries, the journey is a nightmare and last bit a road trip by taxi or Shanks pony.
Best of all would be in the South East of London or just outside, I don't how many people I have heard say if Wasps had stadium around Sevenoaks it would buzz. No professional rugby in this area
I was one of the messengers shot down repeatedly on Drunken Wasps, likewise here fold are (were) even more rose tinted.
The Midlands was a complete disaster, and mostly because for 150 years we have been around / within the M25 and the move was doomed. And then the grossly incompetant management of Eastwood / Vaughan and his merry band of board members that totally ignored the massive annual 7 year losses, and to the end had no plan B. To say our future is in the Midlands is insanity. Yet that is what the genius Holland and his interim CEO Scott are mouthing. Holland is of course tainted as a prior member of the disasterous board, and wants teh Midlands to use his training facility. The Legends are brilliant but he should not be allowed anywhere near the club, yet until we find a long or even medium term financier, he is the proud owner of our trophy cabinet and trading name.
Unless the Legends ditch him , find a backer with deep pockets who can steer us back to the South East, with plans for a newbuild self owned stadium to be put in place within a few years, this new show is not going to get off the ground.
Best of all would be in the South East of London or just outside, I don't how many people I have heard say if Wasps had stadium around Sevenoaks it would buzz. No professional rugby in this area
I was one of the messengers shot down repeatedly on Drunken Wasps, likewise here fold are (were) even more rose tinted.
The Midlands was a complete disaster, and mostly because for 150 years we have been around / within the M25 and the move was doomed. And then the grossly incompetant management of Eastwood / Vaughan and his merry band of board members that totally ignored the massive annual 7 year losses, and to the end had no plan B. To say our future is in the Midlands is insanity. Yet that is what the genius Holland and his interim CEO Scott are mouthing. Holland is of course tainted as a prior member of the disasterous board, and wants teh Midlands to use his training facility. The Legends are brilliant but he should not be allowed anywhere near the club, yet until we find a long or even medium term financier, he is the proud owner of our trophy cabinet and trading name.
Unless the Legends ditch him , find a backer with deep pockets who can steer us back to the South East, with plans for a newbuild self owned stadium to be put in place within a few years, this new show is not going to get off the ground.
2
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Wasps to Sixways - Telegraph
« on: February 10, 2023, 09:56:05 AM »
I feel so desperatley sorry for the Wuss fans. Imagine how we would feel. Have had some great times at Sixways and they are top people down there. This is just horrible for them. Knowing them though, they will not make life hard for Wasps.
I'm with AndyWasp - just pleased we will survive. For now. But we can't long term until we own our own stadium, hopefully this is a staging post for a long term solution nearer Wasps London roots.
For me looking forward to the Ealing / Scots / Richmond games, and "away" to Sixways now and again. Can recommend the Redesdale Hotel and Raj mahal curry house in Moreton in Marsh just up the railway line for a great evening stay / meal post match
I'm with AndyWasp - just pleased we will survive. For now. But we can't long term until we own our own stadium, hopefully this is a staging post for a long term solution nearer Wasps London roots.
For me looking forward to the Ealing / Scots / Richmond games, and "away" to Sixways now and again. Can recommend the Redesdale Hotel and Raj mahal curry house in Moreton in Marsh just up the railway line for a great evening stay / meal post match
3
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: News incoming?
« on: December 22, 2022, 07:51:13 AM »
Depressing to read the interview with our new CEO that he sees this new potential club as a "hard reset" to the Midlands. They just don't learn ...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/64050985
Only hope was a long term vision to get back towards the M25 in my view, contrary to many of you.
We needed a break from the disasterous geography og the last 7 years, and also the management. Holland sat on the useless Wasps board and has motives for staying near his training investment
We dont have this needed clean break
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/64050985
Only hope was a long term vision to get back towards the M25 in my view, contrary to many of you.
We needed a break from the disasterous geography og the last 7 years, and also the management. Holland sat on the useless Wasps board and has motives for staying near his training investment
We dont have this needed clean break
4
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Joe Simpson
« on: December 21, 2022, 07:36:07 AM »
He was a charming bloke, really lovely man. Chatted for a long time to my son and I after a game at AP. Left Wasps too early and unfortunate (like many of our mob) EJ was in charge of England
5
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Wasps Statement - from Offy
« on: December 16, 2022, 04:56:06 PM »
I'm so pleased we have made the RFU sliderule, at same time really sorry for Wuss. However the ground is a disaster, Midlands did not work before and won't now. Only hope was to get some of the London based fans back, and build momemtum for a tilt back at the Prem. Damson Park is in the middle of total nowhere, and a missed chance to get back to the old roots . Won't work but the guys in charge look impressive compared to Vaughan, Eastwood, LOL etc, so maybe they have a plan and this is very short term
6
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Wasps facing relegation
« on: October 13, 2022, 09:28:28 PM »Let’s be clear - there’s still a huge amount to happen here. We don’t know if we’ll be relegated or lose our P share. Once the emphasis shifted from financing the debt to seeking a takeover that was always going to happen in administration. People with the sort of money to buy the level of assets in the mix don’t get that much of it by spaffing it up the wall on a regular basis when they don’t have to. So now we’ll see if any of them are serious. There’s a huge mix of alternatives with Wasps the rugby entity not being of standout appeal but we don’t know. There is a huge amount to happen in this yet.On the other site we call this gent the Dark Knight. Just a flesh wound this is.
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Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Wasps facing relegation
« on: October 13, 2022, 09:23:26 PM »I'm just gutted. Been flagging this for years with our incredible £10m annual losses since 2014, been shot down every time. Gives me no pleasure to say it's been coming a long time.Apart from disagreeing with almost every word you wrote...a couple of things.
I'm not sure if we are still banned from saying anything negative abut Wasps, but if I am banned it doesn't matter now anyway.
My point is I am amazed no-one here is angry with the useless incompetant Wasps board who has presided over this debacle, Eastwood Vaughan and Richardson in particular.
They have watched the disaster unfurl. £60M losses in 6 years. Waited until we hit the buffers and screwed the bond holders and loyal suppliers, with no plan B in 7 years of clear sight Coventry did and could not work.
Lied to people - quote Richardson recent statement
https://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sport/rugby/wasps-owner-derek-richardson-breaks-24747475
So 160 years of history thrown under the bus. Yes we were going under in 2014, but all we have done is extend the pain whilst ruining our reputation with the financial community and rugby community, and taken money from good people with false promises - virtually nothing in the 2014 bond prospectus came to fruition
I was interested to see what hey had to say tonight, but the Wasps website is down
It's not over, possible we can rise but not with the current 3 bids I am aware of. All three want the stadium and not the rugby club, even Armstrongs backers are venture capitalists who will be out for a fast buck
For me if we can find a proper rugby backer soon, who can honour the debts to the bondholders, sell the stadium and retain some staff and players, then get us back to within the M25 or near as hell, we can get back into premiership rugby with a future. And an 18,000 capacity stadium
Your claiming foresight of which almost every rugby support already knows, they all run at huge losses, so you're foresight isn't unique as much as you claim it to be.
I am not sure we'd be here if Covid hadn't gutted our financial model for 2 years, not just in in-flow but decemated in out-flow..
Related to the taking money from good people - purchasing a staggering 6.5% return bond is no different to buying ultra high risk stocks. If you know anything about finance, you'll know what I am saying.
Agreed 100%. I don't think the statement is lying that the businesses are viable in the long-term.
This is the man who boldly stated Lima Sopoaga would be Wasps all time great player. Always gets it right like this new one.
8
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: The endless thread
« on: October 12, 2022, 04:20:35 PM »
Bust and end of thread
9
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Wasps facing relegation
« on: October 12, 2022, 04:18:31 PM »
I'm just gutted. Been flagging this for years with our incredible £10m annual losses since 2014, been shot down every time. Gives me no pleasure to say it's been coming a long time.
I'm not sure if we are still banned from saying anything negative abut Wasps, but if I am banned it doesn't matter now anyway.
My point is I am amazed no-one here is angry with the useless incompetant Wasps board who has presided over this debacle, Eastwood Vaughan and Richardson in particular.
They have watched the disaster unfurl. £60M losses in 6 years. Waited until we hit the buffers and screwed the bond holders and loyal suppliers, with no plan B in 7 years of clear sight Coventry did and could not work.
Lied to people - quote Richardson recent statement
https://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sport/rugby/wasps-owner-derek-richardson-breaks-24747475
So 160 years of history thrown under the bus. Yes we were going under in 2014, but all we have done is extend the pain whilst ruining our reputation with the financial community and rugby community, and taken money from good people with false promises - virtually nothing in the 2014 bond prospectus came to fruition
I was interested to see what hey had to say tonight, but the Wasps website is down
It's not over, possible we can rise but not with the current 3 bids I am aware of. All three want the stadium and not the rugby club, even Armstrongs backers are venture capitalists who will be out for a fast buck
For me if we can find a proper rugby backer soon, who can honour the debts to the bondholders, sell the stadium and retain some staff and players, then get us back to within the M25 or near as hell, we can get back into premiership rugby with a future. And an 18,000 capacity stadium
I'm not sure if we are still banned from saying anything negative abut Wasps, but if I am banned it doesn't matter now anyway.
My point is I am amazed no-one here is angry with the useless incompetant Wasps board who has presided over this debacle, Eastwood Vaughan and Richardson in particular.
They have watched the disaster unfurl. £60M losses in 6 years. Waited until we hit the buffers and screwed the bond holders and loyal suppliers, with no plan B in 7 years of clear sight Coventry did and could not work.
Lied to people - quote Richardson recent statement
https://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sport/rugby/wasps-owner-derek-richardson-breaks-24747475
So 160 years of history thrown under the bus. Yes we were going under in 2014, but all we have done is extend the pain whilst ruining our reputation with the financial community and rugby community, and taken money from good people with false promises - virtually nothing in the 2014 bond prospectus came to fruition
I was interested to see what hey had to say tonight, but the Wasps website is down
It's not over, possible we can rise but not with the current 3 bids I am aware of. All three want the stadium and not the rugby club, even Armstrongs backers are venture capitalists who will be out for a fast buck
For me if we can find a proper rugby backer soon, who can honour the debts to the bondholders, sell the stadium and retain some staff and players, then get us back to within the M25 or near as hell, we can get back into premiership rugby with a future. And an 18,000 capacity stadium
10
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: House of Cards
« on: August 08, 2022, 05:25:15 PM »Is it possible to clutch straws with your head buried in the sand?
I'll be clear here. This is a Wasps forum, if you are solely here to spread negative rumours and run down Wasps you'll be banned.
This is the only warning you, or any others will get.
Oh dear. So there is one strand of opinions allowed and they have to be positive. F'raid VV you are taking a wrong un here and sure I will be banned but your threats are sad.
The forum needs balance and most here simply ignore, and have ignored for years, the stark financial Tsunami of woe that has been Wasps since the Coventry move. I've said it before but will again but how can we survive when racked up over £60m losses since 2015 and the move?
Defaulted on bonds, owe Derek another £20m, about to lose the stadium, rugby results and attendances at home collapsing. Now rumours the contractors won't relay the pitch due to credit issues and now recruitment on hold.
https://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/latest-news/360089/financial-woes-forcewasps-to-halt-recruitment/#respond
These are not "negative rumours" or any attempt to undermine Wasps. We all love our club and want it to last another 150 years. It just looks like it is about to go down the pan, and we need to do something about it as sure as hell Eastwood and Vaughan do not seem to be . Certainly not having a dialogue with Wasps fans on how to refinance and also turn an annual £10m loss making business into a viable entity
Long live the debate!
11
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Should we be worried by this?
« on: June 16, 2022, 08:02:04 PM »
Not true. The whole shebang loses money. Casino, Hotel, Conference centre, Stadium. Hand over fist. Completely the opposite of the prospectus forecasts. The plan was also not for the rugby to be subsidised by the others, but in fact a net contributer. Have a look. Everything was rosy and all were to make money.
Basically the whole business plan has come apart at the seams, and the entire edifice loses so much money every year it dwarfs any premiership side. No premiership side has accumulated almost £60m losses in 7 years.
The bond architect was Nick Eastwood. We have him in place still in the "powers that be" alongside many other chiefs, who now need to deliver the vision, and the plan to reverse years of financial horrors. Unless you have a majic wand - if they could have by now they would have - so what is the plan?
I met Eastwood in a bar in Dublin after our Euro quarter final hammering a few years ago. Very unimpressive and my dad always said never trust a man who wears slip on shoes. My son and I noticed them, and the nylon trousers !
It gives me no pleasure to highight the realism, but we are in shit creek and if we get out of this then I'm buying Eastwood a large dinner, as I eat his slip on's.
But time for the man and his team to talk to us.
Basically the whole business plan has come apart at the seams, and the entire edifice loses so much money every year it dwarfs any premiership side. No premiership side has accumulated almost £60m losses in 7 years.
The bond architect was Nick Eastwood. We have him in place still in the "powers that be" alongside many other chiefs, who now need to deliver the vision, and the plan to reverse years of financial horrors. Unless you have a majic wand - if they could have by now they would have - so what is the plan?
I met Eastwood in a bar in Dublin after our Euro quarter final hammering a few years ago. Very unimpressive and my dad always said never trust a man who wears slip on shoes. My son and I noticed them, and the nylon trousers !
It gives me no pleasure to highight the realism, but we are in shit creek and if we get out of this then I'm buying Eastwood a large dinner, as I eat his slip on's.
But time for the man and his team to talk to us.
12
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Should we be worried by this?
« on: June 16, 2022, 07:05:37 PM »
Er, yes. Very.
It doesn't matter how brilliant our relationships are with local powers, if we simply have an unsustainable business model. You have to be an ostrich to say £10m losses last few years even before pandemic is a business that can continue in that form.
It does impact the bond, as these guys see it:
https://uk.advfn.com/stock-market/london/wasps-22-WAS1/share-chat
Then the fact the bond repayment defaulted on May 13, when Wasps have had 7 years to plan for it.
They simply don't have the money, and this is linked to try and get some liquidity in the business to push thrugh the HSBC financing, likely a mortage or stadium sale, which may be tricky as apparently is a 250 year lease.
Then the lack of communication from the "powers that be". They may be confident but if so, give a statement explaining how a business losing £10m a year, with dwindling stadium attendance an revenues, can be turned round in such a way to either attract a new lender, or even be able to repay it . They have to make a statement now.
The BBC reporter seems to be shot down, simply because he has other interests. But he is bringimng stuff out, even if incomplete, that Wasps management could have headed off at the pass if they a) have a plan and b) were willing to share it with the wider club.
Yes I am worried and have been for years. If you had a business with losses over £50m since the Cventry move, now owing Compass, Derek, Bond holders and other creditors more than the stadium worth, why would you not.
It seems a general mass denial instead.
Hope I'm wrong.
It doesn't matter how brilliant our relationships are with local powers, if we simply have an unsustainable business model. You have to be an ostrich to say £10m losses last few years even before pandemic is a business that can continue in that form.
It does impact the bond, as these guys see it:
https://uk.advfn.com/stock-market/london/wasps-22-WAS1/share-chat
Then the fact the bond repayment defaulted on May 13, when Wasps have had 7 years to plan for it.
They simply don't have the money, and this is linked to try and get some liquidity in the business to push thrugh the HSBC financing, likely a mortage or stadium sale, which may be tricky as apparently is a 250 year lease.
Then the lack of communication from the "powers that be". They may be confident but if so, give a statement explaining how a business losing £10m a year, with dwindling stadium attendance an revenues, can be turned round in such a way to either attract a new lender, or even be able to repay it . They have to make a statement now.
The BBC reporter seems to be shot down, simply because he has other interests. But he is bringimng stuff out, even if incomplete, that Wasps management could have headed off at the pass if they a) have a plan and b) were willing to share it with the wider club.
Yes I am worried and have been for years. If you had a business with losses over £50m since the Cventry move, now owing Compass, Derek, Bond holders and other creditors more than the stadium worth, why would you not.
It seems a general mass denial instead.
Hope I'm wrong.
13
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: New initiative from Saints
« on: December 22, 2021, 08:04:44 AM »
Be interesting to see what the Wasps "senior management " would reply to this post (not from me) on DW, regarding matchday experience. Would also be good if they could comment on the re-financing on the bonds dur by May 2022 :
Putting aside the game itself, it was another shambolic and embarrassing matchday experience once again. The club's standards appear to be dropping week on week.
1. Car Park C was being used as an Amazon Prime lorry park. Not easy to pass through the area due to lots of fencing in the way.
2. The Fanzone appeared to be one mobile drinks caravan. I didn't see any food there although there might well have been.
3. The Casino wasn't providing any food at all. With the number of Munster fans trying to win a fortune at the tables that was an opportunity missed.
4. The Anecdote was rammed and given the Omicron outbreak and Plan B in place to see so many people in there not wearing masks was very concerning.
5. Getting into the East stand was a nightmare. Huge queues caused by very few gate being open and I saw people employing the staff to open more up but they just couldn't care less. Then there was the obligatory be bag search and frisking down of everybody! This only started 2 matches ago but why?
6. Food and drink inside the concourse, overpriced and understaffed at every outlet as usual.
7. Why were they cleaning the floor and making it dangerously slippery?? I saw at least two old guys go down on it.
8. The announcer was awful in the extreme. Sounded bored out of his brains, couldn't pronounce half of the names and clearly hasn't any understanding of rugby and it's supporters.
Well played Munster, not so Mr Poite, and well done to our lads who gave everything but after the red card didn't stand a chance.
What's happening at our great club? Something needs doing fast as without todays travelling support I dread to think how many Wasps fans were actually there. Get it sorted Wasps, please!!!
Putting aside the game itself, it was another shambolic and embarrassing matchday experience once again. The club's standards appear to be dropping week on week.
1. Car Park C was being used as an Amazon Prime lorry park. Not easy to pass through the area due to lots of fencing in the way.
2. The Fanzone appeared to be one mobile drinks caravan. I didn't see any food there although there might well have been.
3. The Casino wasn't providing any food at all. With the number of Munster fans trying to win a fortune at the tables that was an opportunity missed.
4. The Anecdote was rammed and given the Omicron outbreak and Plan B in place to see so many people in there not wearing masks was very concerning.
5. Getting into the East stand was a nightmare. Huge queues caused by very few gate being open and I saw people employing the staff to open more up but they just couldn't care less. Then there was the obligatory be bag search and frisking down of everybody! This only started 2 matches ago but why?
6. Food and drink inside the concourse, overpriced and understaffed at every outlet as usual.
7. Why were they cleaning the floor and making it dangerously slippery?? I saw at least two old guys go down on it.
8. The announcer was awful in the extreme. Sounded bored out of his brains, couldn't pronounce half of the names and clearly hasn't any understanding of rugby and it's supporters.
Well played Munster, not so Mr Poite, and well done to our lads who gave everything but after the red card didn't stand a chance.
What's happening at our great club? Something needs doing fast as without todays travelling support I dread to think how many Wasps fans were actually there. Get it sorted Wasps, please!!!
14
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Match Thread
« on: December 04, 2021, 06:23:02 PM »Umaga also missed the last touch kick from his 25, to gift Wuss their third try. It's his 3rd missed touch and just too many.
Feel for the lad but match after match this is crucifying the team as no.10 is the lynchpin
Apparently it's a prop's fault. Or maybe someone who is injured.
The true incarnation of Ricohchezwasp
15
Wasps Rugby Discussion / Re: Match Thread
« on: December 04, 2021, 05:02:57 PM »
Yup. Alfie made a big difference, and the team as a whole stuck in there with guts, but just not enough. At least we won the tights battle.