Always a Wasp
General Category => Wasps Rugby Discussion => Topic started by: JonnyD on July 08, 2021, 11:18:34 AM
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England XV Starters
15. Freddie Steward (Leicester Tigers, 1 cap)
14. Joe Cokanasiga (Bath Rugby, 10 caps)
13. Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 39 caps)
12. Dan Kelly (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
11. Adam Radwan (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)
10. Marcus Smith (Harlequins, 1 cap)
9. Harry Randall (Bristol Bears, 1 cap)
1. Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers, 29 caps)
2. Jamie Blamire (Newcastle Falcons, 1 cap)
3. Joe Heyes (Leicester Tigers, 1 cap)
4. Harry Wells (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
5. Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 22 caps)
6. Lewis Ludlow (C) (Gloucester Rugby, 1 cap)
7. Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 23 caps)
8. Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins, uncapped)
Finishers
16. Curtis Langdon (Sale Sharks, 1 cap)
17. Beno Obano (Bath Rugby, 2 caps)
18. Paul Hill (Northampton Saints, 5 caps)
19. Callum Chick (Newcastle Falcons, 1 cap)
20. Lewis Ludlam (Northampton Saints, 9 caps)
21. Dan Robson (Wasps, 13 caps)
22. George Furbank (Northampton Saints, 3 caps)
23. Joe Marchant (Harlequins, 5 caps)
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Well off goes McNally and Davison, to be seen in a ruck.co.uk article in 10 years time as ‘players you forgot played for England’ same probably likely for Wells.
At least Eddie is now playing a 12 (eventhough he’s Irish) and has some tactical options on the bench in the backs.
Great news for Dombrandt getting a game and we’ll done from Paul Hill for working his way back into the mix.
Umaga was not good last week but I’m not sure why Eddie continuously talks about Furbank as a 10.
Will watch but it will probably will not tell us anything new
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And he still refuses to give Dan a start.
After all this time.
If I was Dan...I would get out of there and purely concentrate on Wasps.
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Well off goes McNally and Davison, to be seen in a ruck.co.uk article in 10 years time as ‘players you forgot played for England’ same probably likely for Wells.
At least Eddie is now playing a 12 (eventhough he’s Irish) and has some tactical options on the bench in the backs.
Great news for Dombrandt getting a game and we’ll done from Paul Hill for working his way back into the mix.
Umaga was not good last week but I’m not sure why Eddie continuously talks about Furbank as a 10.
Will watch but it will probably will not tell us anything new
Umaga wasn't good last week because Crazy Eddie played him out of position due to his bench cock up, Dan clearly doesn't deserve a start as he underwhelmed on the wing. I wouldn't be surprised if Obano is only on the bench to cover 9 ;)
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And Josh get buggered around again.
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The combination of poor opposition and baffling selection leaves me seriously disinterested. With two games why on earth would you not start Randall in one and Robson the other. Robson is a better SH by some distance. Still it was nice to see Jones accept the blame for last weeks farce by declaring some players still need to learn along with some ridiculous comment about Dan being faster than some wingers. It's a circus without the entertainment.
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The combination of poor opposition and baffling selection leaves me seriously disinterested. With two games why on earth would you not start Randall in one and Robson the other. Robson is a better SH by some distance. Still it was nice to see Jones accept the blame for last weeks farce by declaring some players still need to learn along with some ridiculous comment about Dan being faster than some wingers. It's a circus without the entertainment.
This
England had two outstanding questions (assuming - probably wrongly - that England do sane) First, why were we so poor in the 6Ns and secondly, who would play in the positions that we tend to keep picking the same players - in form or not? (i.e. 8,9,10,12 and 15)
So - it may well be that the answer to 1) is in the selection of out of practice EA's and a failure to adapt to the changes in how the game is being played and can be mainly parked to the AI's but as far as who to play if form or injury strikes.....
8 - Ignore load of Prem players in decent form and play a tyro who you prob wouldn't start before 2024 if ever
9 - Dan needs a start to show if he can being Wasps form and game control to England, so play Randall instead....
10 - Smith, yep, form 10 in the Prem recently
12 - Play someone who play's 12 and would slot in - even at short notice...why isn't Devoto involved then?
15 - Malins needs more game time for England, we know Watson can play 15 but in SA, so I'll play a tyro Tiger....and Malins at wing....
It's like Jones' is actively trolling the team and supporters - what in reality is going to be gained IRO what is needed for RWC '23? Damn all......
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According to the news, Eddie is a fan of Gareth Southgate, and approves of his selection.
I am guessing this means Eddie approves of Southgates' England soccer team, but it could mean that Southgate will be at 9 for the AIs, waistcoat and all. You never know with Eddie.
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According to the news, Eddie is a fan of Gareth Southgate, and approves of his selection.
I am guessing this means Eddie approves of Southgates' England soccer team, but it could mean that Southgate will be at 9 for the AIs, waistcoat and all. You never know with Eddie.
Is that why he keeps picking Dan Robson as a false 9?
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According to the news, Eddie is a fan of Gareth Southgate, and approves of his selection.
I am guessing this means Eddie approves of Southgates' England soccer team, but it could mean that Southgate will be at 9 for the AIs, waistcoat and all. You never know with Eddie.
That really made me giggle. 😂😂😂
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According to the news, Eddie is a fan of Gareth Southgate, and approves of his selection.
I am guessing this means Eddie approves of Southgates' England soccer team, but it could mean that Southgate will be at 9 for the AIs, waistcoat and all. You never know with Eddie.
Is that why he keeps picking Dan Robson as a false 9?
Very good!
It’s not difficult to believe Dan is faster than others and hence putting him to wing, it’s happened with a few Scrum-Halves before but this is more due to going 6/2 against a team we were never likely to lose to and not giving himself the flexibility. Seems unnecessary, it’s not like they were restricted by COVID issues meaning a re-jigged bench like the Lions had during the week.
I think Steward deserved a start, he’s been really good. Malins has earnt some time in the shirt as well based on this season and is also a class act in the Prem. Frankly, I’d be happy with either of them getting game time and taking over the 15 shirt above Daly/Watson. Daly has all the attributes other than the key one of being safe under a high ball and I feel Watson is a better Winger than Full-Back.
I’d rather see Daly on the bench covering multiple positions and ideally played at 13 but it’s a competitive position within the team with Slade/Manu battling it out when fit and then Marchant, Lawrence having great potential.
The Scrum-Half selection is just baffling. Youngs (for me) would be my 4th/5th choice 9 behind Care, Robson, Randall and Spencer (and in that order).
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This
England had two outstanding questions (assuming - probably wrongly - that England do sane) First, why were we so poor in the 6Ns and secondly, who would play in the positions that we tend to keep picking the same players - in form or not? (i.e. 8,9,10,12 and 15)
So - it may well be that the answer to 1) is in the selection of out of practice EA's and a failure to adapt to the changes in how the game is being played and can be mainly parked to the AI's but as far as who to play if form or injury strikes.....
8 - Ignore load of Prem players in decent form and play a tyro who you prob wouldn't start before 2024 if ever
9 - Dan needs a start to show if he can being Wasps form and game control to England, so play Randall instead....
10 - Smith, yep, form 10 in the Prem recently
12 - Play someone who play's 12 and would slot in - even at short notice...why isn't Devoto involved then?
15 - Malins needs more game time for England, we know Watson can play 15 but in SA, so I'll play a tyro Tiger....and Malins at wing....
It's like Jones' is actively trolling the team and supporters - what in reality is going to be gained IRO what is needed for RWC '23? Damn all......
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You correctly identified the reasons for a poor Six Nations, undoubtedly picking out of form players who had next to no recent game time, plus failure to adapt to the way the game is being played until temporarily changing to the style that put the All Blacks away in the WC Semi final when playing France before reverting to the losing formula for the final game against Ireland. What you forgot to mention of course is that according to the RFU review, none of this was Eddie Jones fault. You know, the head coach, the chap who picks the team and determines the game plan and playing style...
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it may well be that the answer to 1) is in the selection of out of practice EA's
Much as I would like to blame Sarries for Englands bad form, IMO Jones' selection was not the issue. if he had picked the most talented & exciting team on the planet, then asked them to kick all their possession away, they would have lost too.
the game plan needs to change before understanding whether personnel also need to be amended.
what would be the point in picking Randall & Smith then asking them to kick the logo off the ball for 80 minutes?
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it may well be that the answer to 1) is in the selection of out of practice EA's
Much as I would like to blame Sarries for Englands bad form, IMO Jones' selection was not the issue. if he had picked the most talented & exciting team on the planet, then asked them to kick all their possession away, they would have lost too.
the game plan needs to change before understanding whether personnel also need to be amended.
what would be the point in picking Randall & Smith then asking ordering them to kick the logo off the ball for 80 minutes?
Had to correct you on this, BP. Mental Eddie doesn't do asking.
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Mental Eddie doesn't do asking
I would disagree, he does ask, with the penalty for not doing as your told not being picked again !
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it may well be that the answer to 1) is in the selection of out of practice EA's
Much as I would like to blame Sarries for Englands bad form, IMO Jones' selection was not the issue. if he had picked the most talented & exciting team on the planet, then asked them to kick all their possession away, they would have lost too.
the game plan needs to change before understanding whether personnel also need to be amended.
what would be the point in picking Randall & Smith then asking them to kick the logo off the ball for 80 minutes?
Hence my suggesting "may well be..." and sure - the kicking game - vs Scotland we kicked away so much ball according to the stats, it was embarrassing - and to a back three happy to run it back. But leaving that aside - the opportunity from these two games was there - to test potential RWC players, in a game situation. And I stand by that being a wasted opportunity, regardless of tactics applied.
But selecting a number of out of touch EA's made the kicking game even more likely, as executing anything else was problematic. Except for a short period vs France for some bizarre reason.
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Had to sell my ticket for tomorrow as someone I was in contact with yesterday has since tested positive. Not in the least bit disappointed to be honest!
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I must stop writing about England...but this is what I find most perplexing.....(well amongst many) The number of people across the platforms I read/contribute to, that seem to be Eddie fans.
His record with other sides is decent enough with some big downs and a clear ability to coach a team to win one off matches like Japan vs SA or Eng vs NZ in the RWC, but seems to have a blindspot when it comes to how teams operate over time.
For England - he inherited a squad and team that still has under Stuart Lancaster, the best 6N's % win record (80% - every year) a big win against and a good tour of NZ and the core of the U-20 teams over several seasons including the World Cup winners. So whilst Lancaster did the major sin of fouling up at a home RWC, in all other measures, his England was pretty good. So coming in and winning the GS and having a good tour vs a fading Australia are good results, but not really evidence of the second coming. And the inept 6Ns in 2018 and Tour to SA saw England on their longest losing streak for ages and playing like they forgot the key objectives.
A RWC for any of the top teams really is a question of winning three games (qualifying is taken as read) and England have always, since I first went to Twickenham in the early 70's, had access to big and effective packs able to beat anyone. So the challenge for England was usually elsewhere - and that was being tackled once the U-20's etc was taken seriously to supply players to the senior team.
So if Jones is that good, excuses like "waiting to do the attack nearer the RWC" sounds like the sort of management balls I've heard in business too often - when projects fail/are delayed. But here we are, wasting chances to test out players and tactics and seemingly a coach who doesn't seem to have watched the same games we all have in recent times. And acting as if the need to build on the good play/players from RWC 19 isn't important. Not as important as proving himself right, regardless.
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I must stop writing about England...but this is what I find most perplexing.....(well amongst many) The number of people across the platforms I read/contribute to, that seem to be Eddie fans.
Mental Eddie bots???
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Unfortunately EJ meeting with Southgate will only reaffirm his belief in sticking to his game plan and favourite players. From what I’ve read and listened to ,seem to have same mindset and keeps faith with out of form players . Southgate though at least has humility and admits to not necessarily using better players but chooses those who will play team game to win.
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According to the news, Eddie is a fan of Gareth Southgate, and approves of his selection.
I am guessing this means Eddie approves of Southgates' England soccer team, but it could mean that Southgate will be at 9 for the AIs, waistcoat and all. You never know with Eddie.
That really made me giggle. 😂😂😂
Glad to be of service.
Thinking about it, Southgate's infamous along the ground penalty suggests he would have difficulty with box kicks, regardless of waistcoat.