Always a Wasp
General Category => Wasps Rugby Discussion => Topic started by: Shugs on June 14, 2022, 05:40:57 PM
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Keep reading how Mike Brown is off here and there but as far as I know he’s still not signed for anyone. I’d offer him a 2 year deal in the blink of an eye. I think he’d be perfect for us at the moment. Don’t know if anyone has picked up a definite destination for him?
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Couldn't agree more. Never been a fan but conversely he's just what we need, if nothing more than to highlight what a real 15 does looks like.
Of the RugbyPass transfer list, there were a few names there as 'released' that under the right conditions are interest peakers. Eg Melani Nanai..unfortunate injuries but when fit is a quality operator.
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Keep reading how Mike Brown is off here and there but as far as I know he’s still not signed for anyone. I’d offer him a 2 year deal in the blink of an eye. I think he’d be perfect for us at the moment. Don’t know if anyone has picked up a definite destination for him?
Not only would he provide the solidity that we'd value - well I would - he would be able to provide an example for up and coming players what they ought to be aiming at.
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+1
We need a bit of gnarly experience in our backline and around the backs in training.
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Ngl but this backline needs flair and energy, that's the last thing Mike Brown would bring. It's a no from me.
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Ngl but this backline needs flair and energy, that's the last thing Mike Brown would bring. It's a no from me.
I was going to post something similar.
We're supposedly going to have a powerful forward pack where we'll dominate (or at least get parity) at set pieces, if that's not the type of platform where you launch exciting attacks, then I don't know what is.
However, the more I thought about it, the more I remembered that Mike Brown isn't just a guy that stands at the back and catches a ball, and isn't quick enough to be an international winger.
His counter attacking play was always very strong. While he may have often sought contact, he often did it without getting isolated, and he'd often make half breaks.
If it's a Mike brown who takes a kick from the opposition full back on his 22 and converts it into a counter attack and a fast ball ruck on the half way line then it's got to be a good thing.
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Ngl but this backline needs flair and energy, that's the last thing Mike Brown would bring. It's a no from me.
No point in flair and energy when you have just knocked the ball on... again.
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Nanai would be interesting. Given an injury free run if he could dip back into his Blues form he’d be a huge asset. Presumably he’d be available on “competitive” terms as well given the current state of the game and his last year or two.
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I would be more than happy for him to come to us.
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I'm not sure I understand the clamour for a player that was just released by Newcastle as surplus for requirements and chastised by Wasps supporters as very limited in his attack play when he was in his prime?
I am happy with Minozzi, Umaga and Crossdale fighting it out.
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He's not exactly an exciting player, but as we seem to have abandoned exciting as a way of playing perhaps a bit of solidity at the back might be a good thing?
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Far too slow to play Premiership rugby.
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This board does make me chuckle.
When he was in his prime playing for England & Quinns he was too slow & couldn't pass, now he has been dropped by Falcons suddenly he's just what we need?
:) :) :)
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This board does make me chuckle.
When he was in his prime playing for England & Quinns he was too slow & couldn't pass, now he has been dropped by Falcons suddenly he's just what we need?
:) :) :)
Not me. Too slow and doesn't pass ;)
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This board does make me chuckle.
When he was in his prime playing for England & Quinns he was too slow & couldn't pass, now he has been dropped by Falcons suddenly he's just what we need?
Glad your chuckling.
He's just what we need because we don't have a 15 can provides the basics of a 15, not because Newc dropped him.
What's slower, Mike Brown or a ball that's being fed into the scrum by the opposition scrum half in our 22..having just regained possession.
Momentum is killing us, shitty hands being the major contributor..no more so than at 15.
lets do it again for a third season?, doing the same things with the same players and expecting a different outcome. Talk about rinse and repeat. In our good season, we always had quality at FB, Lewsey, Gissy, WLR, Piautau, Beale.. Given the latest craze if spiral bombs, we are in for a long old next season.
Lots of 'wood for the trees' going on here.
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This board does make me chuckle.
When he was in his prime playing for England & Quinns he was too slow & couldn't pass, now he has been dropped by Falcons suddenly he's just what we need?
:) :) :)
Not me. Too slow and doesn't pass ;)
Maybe, but he can catch a pass ;D
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This board does make me chuckle.
When he was in his prime playing for England & Quinns he was too slow & couldn't pass, now he has been dropped by Falcons suddenly he's just what we need?
:) :) :)
Not me. Too slow and doesn't pass ;)
Maybe, but he can catch a pass ;D
Yep but not give one unfortunately.
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If Mike Brown is the answer, then I'm not sure we're asking the right question.
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Well the question I’m asking is do we have a rock solid defensive 15. Then, do we have someone with huge premiership and international experience. Do we have someone with a bit of edge. Do we have someone who is very frequently dangerous in attack. In some aspects we do. But, for me, Brown delivers them all.
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Alfie?
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:) :)
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If Mike Brown is the answer, then I'm not sure we're asking the right question.
Then what's the question?
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The real question is "How do Wasps want to play?"
If they want to play to the strengths of the players they have then it has to be attacking, exciting rugby. The players can do it, they just need the right game plan & the freedom to action it.
If however, wasps want a more pragmatic approach then someone like Brown might be a good option, but having a great defensive, solid 15 when the rest of the team is trying to run the ball form everywhere isn't going to work is it?
And yes Hymenoptra, I am chuckling because life's to short to get my knickers twisted about which player plays 15 for Wasps next season. :D
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And yes Hymenoptra, I am chuckling because life's to short to get my knickers twisted about which player plays 15 for Wasps next season. :D
I get what you're saying - and in a sense, you're absolutely correct - but couldn't one apply that logic to pretty much anything? In which case, what's the point in having hobbies/interests/passions/etc. in the first place?
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And yes Hymenoptra, I am chuckling because life's to short to get my knickers twisted about which player plays 15 for Wasps next season. :D
I get what you're saying - and in a sense, you're absolutely correct - but couldn't one apply that logic to pretty much anything? In which case, what's the point in having hobbies/interests/passions/etc. in the first place?
different strokes for different blokes. It also makes a big difference depending on one's age.
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different strokes for different blokes. It also makes a big difference depending on one's age.
That's fair.
I just don't think there's much merit in dismissing other posters' concerns about this issue (or any other) solely on the basis that "life's too short" - if we hand-waved away all concerns for this reason, there wouldn't be much point in having a discussion forum to begin with!
Of course, everyone's going to have their own priorities in life, and caring less about who plays at full-back for Wasps next season than another poster is perfectly valid.
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Well, I'm not suggesting Hymenoptra, or anyone else shouldn't get passionate about Wasps, or anything else they fancy. Not that anyone needs my permission ;D
And no where have I dismissed his opinion.
I was just clarifying why I personally am able to chuckle at this particular issue.
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Well, I'm not suggesting Hymenoptra, or anyone else shouldn't get passionate about Wasps, or anything else they fancy. Not that anyone needs my permission ;D
And no where have I dismissed his opinion.
I was just clarifying why I personally am able to chuckle at this particular issue.
Fair enough, mate! :D
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I would be very surprised if Mike Brown is our only choice, far from it. Lee has himself said it's a position that needs sorting. I would be disappointed if we brought Brown in, we surely can look at better options
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I for one would be very glad to see Mike Brown arrive at the CBS - he could mentor Crossdale, keep him on his toes for the 15 shirt, and offer a solid option off the bench in case of emergency.
Are there "better options" available? Possibly, but are any of them a) available, b) affordable, and c) experienced?
Wasps need another specialist 15 ready for September, IMHO, be it Brown or someone else.
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This board does make me chuckle.
When he was in his prime playing for England & Quinns he was too slow & couldn't pass, now he has been dropped by Falcons suddenly he's just what we need?
Glad your chuckling.
He's just what we need because we don't have a 15 can provides the basics of a 15, not because Newc dropped him.
What's slower, Mike Brown or a ball that's being fed into the scrum by the opposition scrum half in our 22..having just regained possession.
Momentum is killing us, shitty hands being the major contributor..no more so than at 15.
lets do it again for a third season?, doing the same things with the same players and expecting a different outcome. Talk about rinse and repeat. In our good season, we always had quality at FB, Lewsey, Gissy, WLR, Piautau, Beale.. Given the latest craze if spiral bombs, we are in for a long old next season.
Lots of 'wood for the trees' going on here.
You make some good points.
I'm happy with Crossdale being a future star, starting next season.
But I would be equally as happy knowing someone like Brown was steering him through training and creating a partnership with Minozzi aswell.
One season being around the experience of Mike Brown would probably be a superb investment into the overall outcome of Ali Crossdale.
Brown gets the basics right. Ali needs to cement those basics, so that his pace becomes a real weapon (and the fans aren't skipping a heartbeat every time a spiral kick goes up).
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This conversation reminds me of Ben Jacobs.
He was not an A-list player.
Most would suggest that in his time with us, he was a centre that did the basics, but you weren't going to get him side stepping 3 defenders and then running it in from 60 metres.
Instead, he made sure that he did all the basics properly, and it allowed everyone around to do play to their strengths.
At that time, we were a better team with him in than without.
Mike Brown could be that player too.
As I said before, if it's a Mike brown who claims every ball, runs it back 20 metres into contact and sets up a ruck for our dominant forwards, then that could be a win
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We are assuming that, as an ex-Quin, he would want to come to us ;D
Mike Brown has always been that sort of player that I loved when he was in your side (for England) and hated him when you played against him.
For England, he always made me feel safe (as a fan) at the back and if that's what we need then I would support that. Even if it's short term and it brings the standard up of our more exciting prospects. It must have been a rare feeling watching a ball come down to Brown and feel nervous like he was going to drop it.
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Whilst I get that having a solid full back who can catch a high ball & make his tackles is a good thing, I don't see how just dropping such a player into a dis functional back line is going to cure all of Wasps issues.
Its fundamentally a coaching problem & without changing the entire back line Wasps ARE going to be "doing the same things with the <essentially> same players and expecting a different outcome" Its the coaching that has to change. I'm not suggesting the coaches are "Clowns" as some one else suggested but they need to change the plan to one that suits the players, remember they had such a plan not that long ago, or they will need to look for new jobs, IMO.
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But I would be equally as happy knowing someone like Brown was steering him through training and creating a partnership with Minozzi aswell.
One season being around the experience of Mike Brown would probably be a superb investment into the overall outcome of Ali Crossdale.
Don't necessarily disagree but I just don't think such arrangements can be afforded with the new salary cap. Otherwise Wasps could have kept Miller for another couple of years. Look at how many players are retiring or finding themselves out of contract when they probably still have a season or two left & plenty of experience to pass on? Clubs just can't afford to keep them.
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Correct. But Blackett has a stated aim of signing a full back which must mean he has the budget to do it.
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But Blackett has a stated aim of signing a full back which must mean he has the budget to do it.
Good point, I had forgotten that!
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The problem with a solid fb is that when the game breaks up we then often see them lack the cutting edge attacking skills when it’s needed heading in the other direction.
Sometimes you might only get one chance to score and sometimes we saw with England, Brown would often not make the pass and butcher and overlap or a 2 on 1. We’ve also seen that with Freddy Steward creeping in with England. They may catch everything and save you a few tries but maybe cost you heading in the other direction. All depends on what the coaches want I suppose.
For me I’d be ok with our FB dropping a catch and missing a tackle and conceding two tries every now and then if he created three at the other end.
WLR every day for me (apart from the last 6 months) above a prime Mike Brown.
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But Blackett has a stated aim of signing a full back which must mean he has the budget to do it.
Good point, I had forgotten that!
I expect part of the budget is Rob's former salary.
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Whilst I get that having a solid full back who can catch a high ball & make his tackles is a good thing, I don't see how just dropping such a player into a dis functional back line is going to cure all of Wasps issues.
Its fundamentally a coaching problem & without changing the entire back line Wasps ARE going to be "doing the same things with the <essentially> same players and expecting a different outcome" Its the coaching that has to change. I'm not suggesting the coaches are "Clowns" as some one else suggested but they need to change the plan to one that suits the players, remember they had such a plan not that long ago, or they will need to look for new jobs, IMO.
Personally, and as a psychology coach myself, I think we have to get over our conditioned thinking to believe that all insights and change of behaviour has to come purely from within the hierarchy of coaches.
I'm of the belief that both Mike Brown and Christian Wade could provide invaluable insight and vastly broaden awareness of what's possible in the game.
They may come at things from different angles (pace/flair and solid/safety) but the amount of valuable knowledge they could impart (through their journeys and experiences) is utterly unique.
Neither would they be backward about sharing information and insights.
Personally, if the opportunities arose...I would harness their experience.
Not all coaches are going to have all the answers.
In fact the best coaches (Ted Lasso ;D) simply create the platform and facilitate the problem solving process to the players (eg Clive Woodward).
Mike Brown around Ali Crossdale for a year would be better than purely having Everard and Blackett, who are not specialists. Everard was a backrow player, Blackett a wing/centre.
And someone like Mike Brown would keep our rather young back division in good defensive shape...as well as communicating well with his wingers outside him.
But, ultimately I would expect Crossdale to elevate his game...and play the majority of the matches.
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Who's Ted Lasso? Never encountered him before. I've heard of Clive Woodward tho'.
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Perhaps we need Mike Brown as a coach/player and Christian Wade as a player/coach.
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Perhaps we need Mike Brown as a coach/player and Christian Wade as a player/coach.
I think there's a saying...
'True wisdom is knowledge gained through experience'.
I think, as a squad, we need a greater breath of wisdom...even though we have the likes of John Mitchell.
Wisdom comes from many perspectives, not just one or two people.
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Personally, if the opportunities arose...I would harness their experience.
Not all coaches are going to have all the answers.
In fact the best coaches (Ted Lasso ;D) simply create the platform and facilitate the problem solving process to the players (eg Clive Woodward).
😀😅
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Who's Ted Lasso? Never encountered him before. I've heard of Clive Woodward tho'.
I had not heard of Ted Lasso either so searched it - look up Terry Smith (coach), I don’t know how to do the link and it is too long to paraphrase.
Interesting but something like that would be a brave shout - bit like SCW at Southampton (I think).