Always a Wasp
General Category => Wasps Rugby Discussion => Topic started by: Rossm on September 22, 2022, 12:00:46 PM
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Men’s Head Coach Lee Blackett has named his side to take on Bath Rugby at The Rec in Round 3 of the Gallagher Premiership on Friday 23 September, kick off 7.45pm.
Jacob Umaga makes his much anticipated return from injury as he joins the starting line up at full back.
Following an impressive display on Tuesday night vs Newcastle Falcons, Francois Hougaard starts at 14, with Josh Bassett at 11.
Sam Spink and Burger Odendaal form the centre partnership, with Charlie Atkinson and Will Porter linking up at half-backs.
Dan Frost makes his first start of the season and will line up alongside Tom West and Biyi Alo in the front row.
Captain Joe Launchbury links up with Kiran McDonald in the second row, with Nizaam Carr, Jack Willis and Tom Willis in the back row to complete the pack.
Amongst the replacements, Gabriel Oghre features in the squad for the first time this season. Tim Cardall is also set to make his 50th Wasps appearance should he feature in Friday’s game.
Wasps team to face Bath Rugby at The Rec on Friday 23 September, kick off 7.45pm.
1 Tom West
2 Dan Frost
3 Biyi Alo
4 Joe Launchbury (c)
5 Kiran McDonald
6 Nizaam Carr
7 Jack Willis
8 Tom Willis
9 Will Porter
10 Charlie Atkinson
11 Josh Bassett
12 Burger Odendaal
13 Sam Spink
14 Francois Hougaard
15 Jacob Umaga
Replacements
16 Gabriel Oghre
17 Robin Hislop
18 John Ryan
19 Tim Cardall
20 Ben Morris
21 Dan Robson
22 Ryan Mills
23 Zach Kibirige
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BATH: 15 Tom de Glanville, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 13 Jonathan Joseph, 12 Max Ojomoh, 11 Will Muir, 10 Orlando Bailey, 9 Louis Schreuder; 1 Lewis Boyce, 2 Tom Dunn ©, 3 Will Stuart, 4 Dave Attwood, 5 Josh McNally, 6 Miles Reid, 7 Chris Cloete, 8 Richard de Carpentier
Replacements: 16 Tom Doughty, 17 Juan Schoeman, 18 Aranos Coetzee, 19 Quinn Roux, 20 GJ van Velze, 21 Max Green, 22 Piers Francis, 23 Josh Bayliss
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Pretty much as touted. I’m not a big fan of our SH policy at the minute - not really sure why we’re doing that. Glad to see Hougaard start on the wing.
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..... and T Willis back where he belongs at 8.
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Good luck to Jacob. Straight back in at 15.
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Still no Odogwu?. And seems a strange strategy at SH to me. (though I thought DanR was below his best v Bristol)
Good to see TomW where he belongs at 8.
Going to be difficult to call, what with this week's developments.
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Good luck to Jacob. Straight back in at 15.
Will he take the kicking as well? He's probably a shade more reliable that Atkinson. Might Hougaard be an option there?
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Very pleased to see Nemo on the pitch from the start. Obviously it's the result of an injury to Alfie, which isn't good, but I'm a big fan of Nemo and thought he looked sharp when he came on last week.
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I would have been tempted to give Feyi-Waboso a bench slot after Tuesday's performance, rather than Kibirige.
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Good to see TomW where he belongs at 8.
Also good to see (the other) TomW back at 1!
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Very pleased to see Nemo on the pitch from the start. Obviously it's the result of an injury to Alfie, which isn't good, but I'm a big fan of Nemo and thought he looked sharp when he came on last week.
Obviously Alfie's injury is not good news, but even with Alfie fit and available, I think we're looking at our best possible starting back row there (allowing for Brad's injury). I think Lee had maybe been guilty of starting Alfie at all costs, sometimes to the detriment of the team. Tom W is our best 8 by a distance, so made no sense to displace him just to accommodate Alfie. However good Alfie is and may go on to be, as it stands he hasn't made any position his own.
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A pleasant new thread to read.
Not sure whether everyone will be up for this mentally but Bath being out opposition is probably the best we could have hoped for apart from Worcester.
Good to see West start this time and after watching the Bristol game back again I think Porter was decent and Robson poor off the bench so not a massive issue with this selection, especially as Ben Spencer isn’t involved for them.
Good luck to Jacob coming back in, the problem is that our attacking systems will change yet again.
He isn’t a run it back attacking threat like Crossdale, in fact as we saw last year he regularly got turned over doing this. He’ll want to be in as first of second receiver, which then takes away some of the good stuff we’ve seen from Atkinson and Odendaal. Will see what happens here i guess
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Pretty much as touted. I’m not a big fan of our SH policy at the minute - not really sure why we’re doing that. Glad to see Hougaard start on the wing.
Agree with that - I really think that unless he's unfit, Dan needs to be given responsibility and asked to provide leadeship.
Backrow looks a good balance and my preference at 8 given the games we've seen from Tom in recent seasons even when we've not been at our best. The pack ought to be good enough. Let's hope we play as a team and look to do some of the dull stuff, better.
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I hadn’t thought about it until now but I like having Hougaard on the pitch. He’s got loads of experience and seems to be a much better leader than Zach.
I agree with others about the back row, it must be causing their defensive coaches headaches.
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As defensively excellent as Hougaard is, he’s not my idea of a threatening winger. Selection seems all over the shop to me.
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... especially as Ben Spencer isn’t involved for them.
I was surprised to see him missing. Is there an injury I missed?
Ta.
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Officials:
Referee: Wayne Barnes (261st Premiership game).
Assistant Referees: Anthony Woodthorpe and Jonathan Healy.
TMO: Luke Pearce.
Citing Officer: Duncan Bell.
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... especially as Ben Spencer isn’t involved for them.
I was surprised to see him missing. Is there an injury I missed?
Ta.
Concussion, I understand.
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As defensively excellent as Hougaard is, he’s not my idea of a threatening winger. Selection seems all over the shop to me.
He's definitely not a "run it in from your own 22, skipping past 5 defenders" winger.
But I really do think he's a clever winger who is in the right place more often than not.
Given that we've not seen "run it in from your own 22" from any other senior wing options, I don't feel we're losing anything
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Bath's bench: 16 Tom Doughty, 17 Juan Schoeman, 18 Aranos Coetzee, 19 Quinn Roux, 20 GJ van Velze, 21 Max Green, 22 Piers Francis, 23 Josh Bayliss
Despite showing Josh Bayliss at 23, is a 6/2 split. Is Bayliss covering a back as well?
Dry, running rugby. I would have thought a 6/2 split could backfire.
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Paolo must be injured, really hope Spink steps up
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Dobby never does well off the bench, and he's got one of the best rugby brains in our squad. Leaving him out of the starters for someone who is a class below is insanity based on our standard performances.
Pleased to see Nemo at last.
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Leaving him out of the starters for someone who is a class below is insanity based on our standard performances.
As I suggested last week, I wonder if this is another attempt to have Dobby coming on to prevent the kind of melt down seen in week 1. Obviously didn't quite work as expected against Bristol because Wasps never had a lead to defend :)
Personally I would have Dobby starting as he's so influential but we'll see how this game goes.
As other have said, I did hope the off field stuff doesn't impact the players, but given the woeful performances over the last few seasons, maybe some external pressure might be a good thing?
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Dobby never does well off the bench, and he's got one of the best rugby brains in our squad. Leaving him out of the starters for someone who is a class below is insanity based on our standard performances.
+1. A bizarre and baffling selection choice.
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Is it my memory playing up or didn't scrum-halfs used to play the full 80, or maybe just get subbed for the last 10 once convincingly in the bag. Simpson, for example, who I still really miss. And always seems a high stakes gamble to break the half-backs rythm mid-game, so why do we these days bake this into an almost Eddie Jones cake?
And sometimes it's been an on-form Porter getting ditched, not just Robson (who wasn't exactly top of his own game last season; thankfully, looking revived recently).
These days, my heart sinks every time we swap around half-time as far too often marks a turn for the worse a desperate gambit. Also seems to be an unwelcome trend for us to do the same with other players having a good outing, and then all going wrong arounb that position and even beyond - why would you take someone playing out of their skin and glueing things together off? Front row, I get...
I actually think Porter worth backing in rotation but not for this half-game nonsense, which probably does him no good personally either. And what does Robson think about bench-warming, unless nursing something?
Anyone able to set me right in this, beyond welfare (which also doesn't seem to be working for us in recent years), as clearly beyond my grasp...
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*** Fake rumour alert ***
Unless Robson has signalled his intention to leave and we're trying to push Porter to see if he can become first choice quickly
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*** Fake rumour alert ***
Unless Robson has signalled his intention to leave and we're trying to push Porter to see if he can become first choice quickly
I did wonder the same thing.
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*** Fake rumour alert ***
Unless Robson has signalled his intention to leave and we're trying to push Porter to see if he can become first choice quickly
I did wonder the same thing.
The way things are right now, I could probably put the fake rumour alert out regarding numerous players
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Is it my memory playing up or didn't scrum-halfs used to play the full 80, or maybe just get subbed for the last 10 once convincingly in the bag. Simpson, for example, who I still really miss. And always seems a high stakes gamble to break the half-backs rythm mid-game, so why do we these days bake this into an almost Eddie Jones cake?
I was wondering exactly the same - when did routinely subbing scrum halves become a thing?
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I was wondering exactly the same - when did routinely subbing scrum halves become a thing?
About the same time as routinely subbing everyone else became a thing.
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I was wondering exactly the same - when did routinely subbing scrum halves become a thing?
About the same time as routinely subbing everyone else became a thing.
Agree, it's not that new. I had a quick look back to the start of the 2015 season, first 7 games were all Simpson and Robson, sub times were: 60', 55', 59', 65', 63', 53' and 64' which is pretty consistent with the times for the end of last season and start of this one.
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When did starting your best 9 on the bench become a thing?
Not sure how Jacob comes in when 15 was one if the few success stories last week.
Frankly, I feel there is something odd afoot, regardless of the stories about the finances.
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When did starting your best 9 on the bench become a thing?
Not sure how Jacob comes in when 15 was one if the few success stories last week.
Frankly, I feel there is something odd afoot, regardless of the stories about the finances.
With both Matteo and Ali injured, then you could say that Jacob is 3rd choice.
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When did starting your best 9 on the bench become a thing?
Not sure how Jacob comes in when 15 was one if the few success stories last week.
Frankly, I feel there is something odd afoot, regardless of the stories about the finances.
As with so many other things, the answer is "Blame Sarries"!
Through much of their successful (I know!) period in the 2010s they had 2 international scrum halves to keep sweet with neither De Kock or Wigglesworth a first choice as such, just rotated in and out as needed.
Looking back through Premiership finals up to that point, backs were hardly ever subbed, much less half backs. In Wasps' last successful final, all 7 starting backs played the whole game, but for a couple of last minute changes to get everyone on when the game was already won.
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When did starting your best 9 on the bench become a thing?
Not sure how Jacob comes in when 15 was one if the few success stories last week.
Frankly, I feel there is something odd afoot, regardless of the stories about the finances.
I'd guess Lee knows he needs to turn things around relatively quickly or find himself in trouble so is grasping at straws.
We saw some odd selection choices for a while when things weren't going well for DY.
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I'd guess Lee knows he needs to turn things around relatively quickly or find himself in trouble
but is he reallly?
I know theres a few vocal posters on here who want him gone but how wider is that feeling?
How does the club management & players feel?
Genuine question.
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I'd guess Lee knows he needs to turn things around relatively quickly or find himself in trouble
but is he reallly?
I know theres a few vocal posters on here who want him gone but how wider is that feeling?
How does the club management & players feel?
Genuine question.
I don't know for sure, hence "I'd guess", but I would expect that the powers that be are fully aware of both the performances, and how they are being receieved by the fan base.
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I personally am frustrated with the performances from the last few seasons when essentially the same team stormed to the final not that long ago. For me the coaching team have had enough time to fix the problem & get playing the way we know they can, but I don't know whether this means the coaches should be replaced. Maybe its time for a change of some kind?
It took a lot of poor performances for Dai Young to get the sack, I can't see Derek acting swiftly to replace LB, especially with the current financial issues.
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I personally am frustrated with the performances from the last few seasons when essentially the same team stormed to the final not that long ago. For me the coaching team have had enough time to fix the problem & get playing the way we know they can, but I don't know whether this means the coaches should be replaced. Maybe its time for a change of some kind?
It took a lot of poor performances for Dai Young to get the sack, I can't see Derek acting swiftly to replace LB, especially with the current financial issues.
And who would be willing to come here as a replacement at the moment? ( unless their at a club that they think is in bigger doodoos than us).
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Scrum Halves need to literally follow the ball all game so they should be flagging by the hour mark.
It's no coincidence that supporters are often saying the replacement no 9 upped the tempo and moved the ball quicker than the starting 9, it's because outside the set pieces he's been running almost non stop.
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I personally am frustrated with the performances from the last few seasons when essentially the same team stormed to the final not that long ago. For me the coaching team have had enough time to fix the problem & get playing the way we know they can, but I don't know whether this means the coaches should be replaced. Maybe its time for a change of some kind?
It took a lot of poor performances for Dai Young to get the sack, I can't see Derek acting swiftly to replace LB, especially with the current financial issues.
Agree.
I do wonder if Lee got the job because finances were already tight and it was cheaper to promote from within.
That being said, coaches can learn from adversity. Look what has happened to Stuart Lancaster following England's world cup[size=78%].[/size]
Once promoted to the top job, Lee should absolutely be trusted to run the team, and once problems set in, be given the time to show he can turn it around. He's now had time, and opportunity to fix the weaknesses he's identified, so this is now the time for him to show what we can do.
An interesting question...
How many would have Dai back as head coach?
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Scrum Halves need to literally follow the ball all game so they should be flagging by the hour mark.
It's no coincidence that supporters are often saying the replacement no 9 upped the tempo and moved the ball quicker than the starting 9, it's because outside the set pieces he's been running almost non stop.
2004 Heineken Cup Final. Final minute. 33 year old starting scrum half still looked like he had plenty in the tank. So what's changed?
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I think there have been more changes in those 18 years than many would think.
Looking at averages from back then to now, ball in play time has increased by almost 10%, the number of rucks by over 20% and the number of tackles almost 35%. So, a 9 would have more breakdowns to get to and be covering more ground than they were c.2004. Also the number of box kicks and therefore kicks a 9 is making have increased - back in 2003 for example only 6% of kicks were box kicks, now around 25% of kicks are and that will increase the workload on the 9.
You could equally ask why we change props when in 2003 the whole Woodman, Thomspon and Baxter played 100 mins and Vickery and Young were only changed in injury time.
I had a look back and the change started to happen around 2010-12, for example in the 2011-12 season we had Nic Berry and Joe Simpson regularly swapping at around the 55 min mark.
I do think any professional scrum half could play 80 mins and still have some running in them but I also think that it is one of the positions where a change can re-energise the attack.
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When did starting your best 9 on the bench become a thing?
Not sure how Jacob comes in when 15 was one if the few success stories last week.
Frankly, I feel there is something odd afoot, regardless of the stories about the finances.
With both Matteo and Ali injured, then you could say that Jacob is 3rd choice.
Apologies- forgot Ali got a knock
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It's probably that players output and explosiveness is monitored more now than it used to be.
If their intensity drops by x% then they likely get replaced