Champions Cup Round 1 thoughts

[FrankWasp]

Just to enlighten me if you have a player on the bench and he does not come on does that count as rested, or does he need week off, no training etc.?

[Heathen]

Just to enlighten me if you have a player on the bench and he does not come on does that count as rested, or does he need week off, no training etc.?

Given how relatively litle time Jack and Dan actually played across the 4 games, there is a valid argument that says they have already had their rest. Joe and Will will need a break.

[Neils]

Just to enlighten me if you have a player on the bench and he does not come on does that count as rested, or does he need week off, no training etc.?

Given how relatively litle time Jack and Dan actually played across the 4 games, there is a valid argument that says they have already had their rest. Joe and Will will need a break.

Again a question - Not disputing Will might need a rest but he is not part of the England agreement so does it apply?

[Rossm]

Just to enlighten me if you have a player on the bench and he does not come on does that count as rested, or does he need week off, no training etc.?

Given how relatively litle time Jack and Dan actually played across the 4 games, there is a valid argument that says they have already had their rest. Joe and Will will need a break.

Dobby spent more time on the field for us last Saturday than he did for Jones in the last 4 England games.

[wasps]

With player welfare being such a prominent subject, I would think that the agreement would include mental well-being as well as physical.

Someone like Dan is still training as if he's going to play and has to be as prepared as Youngs both physically and mentally



Rather than get caught up in a discussion regarding mental v physical rest, I would think it easier for the authorities to suggest that players need to time off even if they have only played a few minutes

[mike909]

Weakened sides? Over those 4 games we've been missing, at some point, Minozzi, Robson, Willis J, Willis T, Vailanu, Launchbury, Rowlands, Vellacott, Umaga, Mills, Fekitoa, Watson, Harris, McIntyre, Oghre, Douglas, Gaskell, Shields, Simonds, Curran and probably a couple I've missed. We've been weakened as well.

Yeah - we are in danger of being too hard on ourselves - whilst needing to recognise that we have also played rather badly at times. But I agree re the weakened side - it's too easy to remember how a weakened team beat a full strength Sarries - but forgetting that at the time we were on a roll - and playing with nil pressure. Having got to the final, we're now "suffering" the issue of expectations.....

[matelot22]

Are you forgetting that our, mostly, second string team thrashed Sarries a matter of weeks ago?

I'll probably never forget that game, it was heroic, but you can't expect results like that week in week out.

I'm not saying we could, or should, expect that on a regular basis, merely pointing out that our strength in depth isn't, perhaps, as wanting as you're implying. I think there are a couple of weak areas, 2nd row most notably, where we could do with an uplift, but I don't think we're that much worse off than most teams.

Your using a previous example to justify your opinion, ignoring other more recent examples that counter your opinion.

What a strange reply. How is one expected to form an opinion without using previous examples?

I'm not ignoring anything, I haven't said we're in the same form as the latter part of last season, I'm stating that there are mostly adequate players throughout the squad to provide the depth we need. That claim is very much backed up by fairly recent examples.

Form is temporary, as we're so often told by sporting analysts.

[hookender]

Just to enlighten me if you have a player on the bench and he does not come on does that count as rested, or does he need week off, no training etc.?

Given how relatively litle time Jack and Dan actually played across the 4 games, there is a valid argument that says they have already had their rest. Joe and Will will need a break.

Again a question - Not disputing Will might need a rest but he is not part of the England agreement so does it apply?

As far as I’m aware Will (and Minozzi) don’t have to be given time off.

The risk is that they may be too tired to give there best at next game. Or if you know they will be leaving soon do you just wreck them.

[Hymenoptera]

Weakened sides? Over those 4 games we've been missing, at some point, Minozzi, Robson, Willis J, Willis T, Vailanu, Launchbury, Rowlands, Vellacott, Umaga, Mills, Fekitoa, Watson, Harris, McIntyre, Oghre, Douglas, Gaskell, Shields, Simonds, Curran and probably a couple I've missed. We've been weakened as well.

All you've done is listed every single player, including players that don't get near a first team, why not take the time to go look at the other teams that we beat and look at their first team STARTING players not available...
We have done this to death Shugs, you think we are great, I don't, lets just park it.

[DGP Wasp]

As far as I’m aware Will (and Minozzi) don’t have to be given time off.

The risk is that they may be too tired to give there best at next game. Or if you know they will be leaving soon do you just wreck them.

Minozzi missed Italy's game against Fiji (along with everyone else) and was released back to Wasps for the last of Italy's games and has since had a couple of 20 minute run outs from the bench.  He should be good to go this weekend.  Agree Rowlands put in a few big shifts for Wales, although I don't think he played the full 80 in any of them due to partnering AWJ, but may benefit from a rest.

The mandatory rest weeks are only as part of the RFU/PRL agreement, so these two are for Wasps to manage as they see fit, and I trust them to do that in everyone's best interests.