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Author Topic: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled  (Read 64820 times)

Neils

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #270 on: January 17, 2020, 12:46:39 PM »
I think articles are evolving. Look at the post date and you should see if it is fairly recent. BBC News had a more up to date report than their website just now.
Let me tell you something cucumber

InBetweenWasp

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #271 on: January 17, 2020, 12:53:05 PM »
Of course, then they can play the "winning against adversity" card.

Juts saw that Brendan Venter tweeted about 3 hours ago:

"The thing i am now looking fwd to most is when the Daily Mail latches on to the fact that various other clubs have been doing some creative accounting to stay within the cap. Will all the haters stay loyal to their moral compasses. This story far from over yet."

And if they are, then they too should be punished accordingly.  It’s not like there’s been a campaign from the likes of Wray to change the rules, or rebates to accommodate the problem of keeping homegrown players which has been ignored by PRL or the other clubs.  He’s just simply thrown extra cash at it.

Peej

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #272 on: January 17, 2020, 12:58:24 PM »
Of course, then they can play the "winning against adversity" card.

Juts saw that Brendan Venter tweeted about 3 hours ago:

"The thing i am now looking fwd to most is when the Daily Mail latches on to the fact that various other clubs have been doing some creative accounting to stay within the cap. Will all the haters stay loyal to their moral compasses. This story far from over yet."

Epic gaslighting and what-abouttery. His denial that Sarries cheated basically renders his whole argument invalid. There is a spectacular send of entitlement and arrogance in Sarries behaviour.

In the Off the Ball podcast the host called Kruis out for talking bollocks when he said it was about opinions and perspectives as to whether they had done anything wrong - he basically said "there's no matter of opinion, you cheated."

wasps

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #273 on: January 17, 2020, 01:36:09 PM »

He's probably right, based on the info we have from when he was at Saracens.
At that time, we know that a couple of clubs were in breach of the cap - and they were just the ones that were caught.

The new guy at Saracens even said that they previously didn't care about the cap because so many clubs were exploiting holes in it.... but that now everyone seems to be obeying the cap, so they need to as well.

When Ventner was last in the prem, there probably was a number of clubs doing "stuff".... whether they still are or not is a different matter

southamwasp

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #274 on: January 17, 2020, 01:55:57 PM »
With all this unfolding, will it not be the case that the saracens brand becomes so toxic that the clubs major sponsors will withdraw all funding. They will then struggle to find replacement benefactors. This then presents itself as a major hurdle to any party considering investing in the club.

matelot22

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #275 on: January 17, 2020, 02:07:46 PM »
With all this unfolding, will it not be the case that the saracens brand becomes so toxic that the clubs major sponsors will withdraw all funding. They will then struggle to find replacement benefactors. This then presents itself as a major hurdle to any party considering investing in the club.

One can only hope so

Neils

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #276 on: January 17, 2020, 02:18:54 PM »
With all this unfolding, will it not be the case that the saracens brand becomes so toxic that the clubs major sponsors will withdraw all funding. They will then struggle to find replacement benefactors. This then presents itself as a major hurdle to any party considering investing in the club.

One can only hope so

Very big +1 on this
Let me tell you something cucumber


mike909

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #278 on: January 17, 2020, 03:09:47 PM »

He's probably right, based on the info we have from when he was at Saracens.
At that time, we know that a couple of clubs were in breach of the cap - and they were just the ones that were caught.

The new guy at Saracens even said that they previously didn't care about the cap because so many clubs were exploiting holes in it.... but that now everyone seems to be obeying the cap, so they need to as well.

When Ventner was last in the prem, there probably was a number of clubs doing "stuff".... whether they still are or not is a different matter

I believe that 4 or 5 seasons ago, several clubs were sailing close to the salary cap wind. All said they would reform and afaik, they did, except Sarries - hence where we are

But Sarries made it difficult to ignore when you look at their squad....5 England starters in the pack and at least three Lions starters in their backs and the ability to put out sides with 500+ caps in the Prem... they were well out on a limb and obviously not even trying - if other teams were paying over, it wasn't resulting in anything like that in terms of first team or squad.

Tervueren

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #279 on: January 17, 2020, 03:20:23 PM »
From the Telegraph just now:

Saracens players have been told the club will accept a further 35-point deduction that will effectively spell relegation from the Premiership.

The English and European champions were deducted 35 points and fined £5.4 million having been in breach of Premiership Rugby’s salary cap over the past three seasons. Rival clubs remain convinced that they are spending way over the £7m limit this season, by as much as £2m.

After a meeting of Premiership clubs on Tuesday night, Saracens were subsequently handed an ultimatum to prove they were compliant with the cap this season or face a further draconian punishment.

New chief executive Edward Griffiths was confident that he could trim the wage bill at first by offloading squad players and those coming towards the end of their contracts. However, with the majority of Premiership clubs spending up to the salary cap, that task proved far harder than he first imagined, particularly as few clubs were willing to grant Saracens any favours. Nor could Saracens simply release players from their contracts as severance payments would count towards the cap.

It seems that Saracens have now accepted their fate and told the players at a meeting on Friday they are certain to be playing in English rugby’s second tier next season. The second deduction would bring their points down to -42 points, which would put them 53 points away from safety, as it stands, with 14 matches left to play. Only a miracle could keep them in the division.

Telegraph Sport understands players face individual meetings next week to discuss their futures. Saracens provided a large portion of the England team that reached the World Cup Final including the Vunipola brothers, Owen Farrell and Maro Itoje, whose co-investments with former chairman Nigel Wray first attracted the attention of Premiership Rugby’s salary cap manager, Andrew Rogers.

The Rugby Football Union have indicated that there is nothing to stop England head coach Eddie Jones from selecting players in the Championship, but whether matches against the likes of Ampthill and Hartpury would be sufficient preparation for international rugby is entirely another matter. Particularly in the season leading into the Lions tour to South Africa, those leading players face a stark test of their loyalty to each other and the club.

Saracens have the opportunity to qualify for the knockout stages of the Champions Cup if they beat Racing 92 at Allianz Park on Sunday. However even if they won European rugby’s elite competition for a fourth time, they would not be allowed to defend their title next season as sides sitting outside the Premiership are ineligible to compete.

Neils

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #280 on: January 17, 2020, 03:27:54 PM »
Wow moment.
Let me tell you something cucumber

Tervueren

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #281 on: January 17, 2020, 03:30:02 PM »
I think we still need to get to 28 points to be safe

DanJester

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #282 on: January 17, 2020, 03:33:37 PM »
Not sure another points deduction is appropriate/sufficient.

If there's still a chance they might still stay up, then they'll manage it, by playing their (Still!) salary cap breaking squad. Automatic relegation would be a more effective punishment for the whole affair.

Maybe play out the remainder of their fixtures, Sarries can earn no points, but opposition teams can, to avoid the matches being dead rubbers.

mike909

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #283 on: January 17, 2020, 03:33:49 PM »
From the Telegraph just now:

The Rugby Football Union have indicated that there is nothing to stop England head coach Eddie Jones from selecting players in the Championship, but whether matches against the likes of Ampthill and Hartpury would be sufficient preparation for international rugby is entirely another matter. Particularly in the season leading into the Lions tour to South Africa, those leading players face a stark test of their loyalty to each other and the club.


I always felt loyalty to the body that paid my wages......but once that stopped (or had I been offered 50% of current) my loyalty might well have wavered......

I mean Daly must feel so much loyalty to a club that developed him as a player such that he became an England regular and Lions starter...oh....

mike909

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Re: EAs BBC - Squad May Be Dismantled
« Reply #284 on: January 17, 2020, 03:35:45 PM »
Not sure another points deduction is appropriate/sufficient.

If there's still a chance they might still stay up, then they'll manage it, by playing their (Still!) salary cap breaking squad. Automatic relegation would be a more effective punishment for the whole affair.

Maybe play out the remainder of their fixtures, Sarries can earn no points, but opposition teams can, to avoid the matches being dead rubbers.

I'd prefer to just take away the results to date and abandon Sarries as a Prem side this season. No incentive to play competitive teams and could alter the Prem outcomes in terms of fairness.

EA's out, now.