A bit lost for words - International selections

[Raggs]

I've not posted as much as I'd probably have expected on the international selections.  In truth, it's because I'm rather shocked, and not sure what to say.  I'm shocked Launch isn't going to the lions, I'm shocked that Taylor and Robson aren't off to Argentina, surprised that Hask isn't on the Lions and that Wade+JCW aren't off to Arg, and disappointed that Jones and Symons aren't off either.

I'm not sure what Eddie is trying to do, all I can really see is that he's seemingly managed to get almost every single vaguely promising player in the AP, involved in one camp or another.  Perhaps trying to see everything that is on offer.

I can't say I think taking the Currys to Arg is a bad idea, they're both already doing so well at just 18, that they could have big futures.  Equally Maunder has settled well at AP level from what we've seen.  Fiji Joe has future England wing written all over him, so I can't argue that.  Mallinder has class but needs to prove he can be physical in defence etc.  My only concern is that England isn't where these players should be developing their skills.  They should be showing effectively international ability with their clubs, that show them to basically be ready for international selection (not necessarily blow the international world away, but at least do their job effectively), rather than international potential which is attempted to be developed at international level.

Perhaps he's happy with his normal 25/26 that he's using, and confident they can go all the way to 2019, and now he's looking for players that in 3-4 years time could be capable of taking over, but as I said, I think players should show they are capable with their clubs, and then be given a shot, rather than show that they are half decent when young, but never get anywhere.  A huge number of players have looked like potential rockstars as youngsters, but never  really developed or improved, and especially after a 2nd or 3rd season after analysis has exposed their weaknesses no longer look like internationals in the making.

I just hope that we don't pin our future hopes on a large number of very young players, who never end up reaching the potential they showed, whilst a number of already talented mid 20 year old players, miss out on the international exposure required to take their game to the utmost level.  There's always a danger of chasing the most exciting youngster, and considering someone at 27 to be over the hill, when in truth they could easily continue to operate at an exceptionally high level until well into their 30s.

[Vespula Vulgaris]

I am much the same as you.  I don't really get it.  I am sure he has a plan, and whilst I understand he is a clearly a great coach - he did wonders with what was essentially Lancaster's failing squad - I have a lot less respect for his selections.

I am deeply concerned that this is meerly a way of tying potentially good players to England without actually giving them the opportunity to play for their countries at any real level.  In much the same way coaches have for years.  Give them one or two early caps, and then ditch them for someone more suitable.

[Gaz]

Agree with that Raggs. We are being told on 'the other forum' by Saints and Sarries supporters that our players are just not as good as we think, that may be true but their non-selection is not necessarily my issue. What sticks in my craw is exactly the issue you describe. Why take potential when there is a talented and proven bunch of 25 year olds around the league who could all have two world cups in them?

Why reward an NZ/Samoan cross code convert of weeks when we have Roko, Woodburn, Wade, etc who have done their time, and that selection goes against everything Ian Ritchie has been saying for months.

I think it was SCW who said that test level is not an incubator or a nursery, and I agree with that while allowing time for players to adjust to the step up, you'd hope they already have the proven skills and experience at the highest club level before they get there. Earning an England cap should be the pinnacle of a career, not the start of it. It devalues the cap and makes a mockery of test level being 'elite'.

Not happy.

[Vespula Vulgaris]

Agree with that Raggs. We are being told on 'the other forum' by Saints and Sarries supporters that our players are just not as good as we think,

That may well be the case, but our league position would seem to suggest otherwise.

[Raggs]

I've not been even reading the long topics on drunken wasps, let alone not replying.

Maunder is one that confuses me a bit to be honest.  He's looked solid, but little more.  I've not seen the breaks or flair that Youngs gets rightly praised for when he's having a good game. I've not seen an amazing kicking game. I've not seen him driving the tempo.  He's looked like a very typical Exeter player to be honest, good basics and solid performance, but I've not seen things from him as we have from the likes of LCD or Slade, who have shown genuinely impressive physical/skillful  aspects to their game.

I understand that Maunder is young, but the other young guys that have broken through and made a real impression have shown glimpses of real game breaking talent, even at a young age (Farrell for his determination, Ford, Daly, Billy V, Curry twins).  I'm not suggesting that every player that makes it to international was a game breaker at age grade, but those that weren't took seasons to grow their all round game to very very solid performers (Launchbury I suppose would be a good example).  Perhaps I've just not seen enough of Maunder, but he's struck me as a Wigglesworth, rather than a Youngs (albeit a better passer) or a Robson.