London Irish v Wasps: Post Match Thoughts

[Heathen]

I really don't like it when posters single out a player for particular criticism however, in the context of the game, I haven't seen many bigger brain farts than Will's decision to go for that tap and go this afternoon.

his flapping like amateur birdman rather than picking up the ball and kicking it out at that final ruck when time was up might be up there with it on the the brain fart front.

He played it quite well. He looked up at the clock and went for another phase because CMK told him to. He then confirmed with CMK that time was up but as he went for the ball Irish put a huge shove in and our forwards went backwards and he couldn't get the ball. Scrum halves do that sort of thing week in week out at then end of games, it just went horribly wrong this time.

Sorry he f'd up IMHO. He was not controlling the pack as a 9 should do.

[Egret]

I really don't like it when posters single out a player for particular criticism however, in the context of the game, I haven't seen many bigger brain farts than Will's decision to go for that tap and go this afternoon.

his flapping like amateur birdman rather than picking up the ball and kicking it out at that final ruck when time was up might be up there with it on the the brain fart front.

He played it quite well. He looked up at the clock and went for another phase because CMK told him to. He then confirmed with CMK that time was up but as he went for the ball Irish put a huge shove in and our forwards went backwards and he couldn't get the ball. Scrum halves do that sort of thing week in week out at then end of games, it just went horribly wrong this time.

+1

He had the presence of mind to keep checking the clock waiting for it to show 80:00 when the counter ruck came

[RogerE]

He did make a mare of the attempted quick tap and go, when he should have helped run the clock down and waited for Charlie or Umaga to boot it upfield as far as possible.

However you can't blame him alone for the turnover.  You could definitely see him glancing up to the clock and hear him checking with CMK on Reflink.

The actual turnover was the pack's fault. They should have not allowed it to happen. The ball was on our side and they should have protected it.

[JonnyD]

Also this one moment of missing out on 2 potential points is not the sole contributing factor to us not qualifying for the top tier of European rugby, nor is it only Porter’s fault.

Plenty of others have made mistakes this season, some have cost us points, some have contributed to us losing games - as much as we’re calling this knock out rugby at this stage of the season damage has already been done.

The defeats againsnt Worcester and Glaws back to back earlier in the season (before we went on a run against better teams) we’re extremely frustrating, episodes like that need equal blame.

[Rossm]

Thinking more about it, I have a feeling that Lee should have given the subs a few more minutes to play themselves into the game and try to get up to speed.  But I think he was absolutely right to take off our stars and wrap them in cotton wool for Edinburgh. Every other DoR/Head Coach would have done the same, particularly with the Edinburgh game just 6 days away. To blame him for bringing the subs on is just so wrong.

[Westy68]

It's not a case of bringing on the subs, as you correctly said most DOR's would have done the same think. The problem I have is the attitude the players had when coming on. None of them looked pumped up to me or wanted to prove a point. That is a coaching issue

[Mellie]

It's not a case of bringing on the subs, as you correctly said most DOR's would have done the same think. The problem I have is the attitude the players had when coming on. None of them looked pumped up to me or wanted to prove a point. That is a coaching issue

I think maybe Porter wanted to prove a point by uping the tempo, like he's done previously. Unfortunately that was not what was required at that stage.

The coaches should have briefed the players that came on regarding what was required of them, particularly the less experienced ones. Message should have been stay in control and keep pressing Irish and stop any momentum from them. We didn't need any more points so no need to take risks.

[Westy68]

It's not a case of bringing on the subs, as you correctly said most DOR's would have done the same think. The problem I have is the attitude the players had when coming on. None of them looked pumped up to me or wanted to prove a point. That is a coaching issue

I think maybe Porter wanted to prove a point by uping the tempo, like he's done previously. Unfortunately that was not what was required at that stage.

The coaches should have briefed the players that came on regarding what was required of them, particularly the less experienced ones. Message should have been stay in control and keep pressing Irish and stop any momentum from them. We didn't need any more points so no need to take risks.

100% agree with that

[Bloke in North Dorset]

It's not a case of bringing on the subs, as you correctly said most DOR's would have done the same think. The problem I have is the attitude the players had when coming on. None of them looked pumped up to me or wanted to prove a point. That is a coaching issue

I think maybe Porter wanted to prove a point by uping the tempo, like he's done previously. Unfortunately that was not what was required at that stage.

The coaches should have briefed the players that came on regarding what was required of them, particularly the less experienced ones. Message should have been stay in control and keep pressing Irish and stop any momentum from them. We didn't need any more points so no need to take risks.

How do you know they didn't? If players played exactly the way coaches told them to play week in, week out they'd never lose.

[Rossm]

As someone posted earlier, scrummies have to be kept on a very tight leash.

[Westy68]

Of course they wouldn’t, but I’m pretty sure the tigers players play exactly how borthwick wants them to play.

Some coaches are just better then others, as some players are better than others.

Most professional rugby players on they day are good players. The really good players are good more often. It’s not just about ability it’s more about mental attitude.

The quality players are able to maintain the high qualities more often. This is why players like Alfie are so special because They’re consistent level of quality is so high.

Our great team of 2005,6,7 and 8 had a mental believe that was ridiculously high. Not all of them were world class or even internationals but the set up at Wasps was just fantastic

[Heathen]

Our great team of 2002 to 2008, had a mental belief that was ridiculously high. Not all of them were world class or even internationals but the set up at Wasps was just fantastic. 8 trophies in that period.

And therein lies the rub.

Since Lol retired, zilch. Yes, we did reach 2 GP finals and a HC S/F but failed (albeit close on two occasions).

Do we need a sports shrink or someone of the SE mould to shake them up?

Answers on a postcard to Stephen Vaughan.

[WonkyWasp]

Smiler  (dream on).

[Andywasp50]

I don’t think Blackett was wrong to bring subs on, but I think he was wrong in the way he used them.

Hougaard hasn’t played for weeks yet played a full match on the wing whilst we had a winger at full back. He looked tired and stranded in the last 15 and got away with a knock forward on our 5 metre line. I would have pushed Zak onto the wing and brought on Umaga, especially to support our midfield with his kicking game. Either that or swapped him and Charlie around so Atkinson went to 15.

Thomas Young hasn’t played for a long time either and it really showed - he was completely off the pace and it unbalanced our back row. Shields and J Willis had given everything so I’d have kept the unit the same or played Gaskell (he hasn’t played for a while either) on the flank and kept Stooke and Launchbury together.

The biggest impact though was Fekitoa to 12 with Odogwu at 13. They were left chasing shadows and huge gaps appeared in our midfield, with Atkinson looking lost. Is Mills injured again because we were crying out for a clever 12 to support Atkinson on and off the ball? As it stood I would have kept Gopperth on.

West’s very early head injury meant Harris was running out of gas, and when Frost and Miller-Mills came on our scrum went to pieces. The scrum lost a lot of weight and power all round and we lost control of the set piece. I’m not sure Millar-Mills brings any quality at all to be honest.

All very easy to say with hindsight, and even a mega pessimist like myself thought the game was done and dusted with 13 mins to go, so what do I know…!

[Heathen]

West’s very early head injury....

I would like to see the stat's on the frequency of HIs sustained by Tom.