Always a Wasp

Author Topic: British and Irish super league plan discussed and could include South Africa  (Read 1776 times)

Neils

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14744
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
British and Irish ?super league? plan discussed ? and could include South Africa and Italy

Exclusive: The competition could be created within the next three years as executives attempt to fight against the current financial climate
By Gavin Mairs, Chief Rugby Union Correspondent, in Paris 18 October 2023 ? 6:54pm

Talks to establish a British and Irish ?super league? that would also include clubs from South Africa and Italy have taken place between executives from the home unions and the leagues, Telegraph Sport can reveal.

It is understood that initial discussions have already taken place at the World Cup and the catalyst is a shared sense to capture and recreate the atmosphere, colour, and drama of the tournament in France by exploring what would be the most radical overhaul of the club game since the sport turned professional in 1995.

It is understood there are also moves for greater collaboration between the URC, Premiership Rugby, the Six Nations and British and Irish Lions to pool back-room resources to dramatically reduce the costs of running the competitions and increase shared revenues and attractiveness to investors by centralising resources.

?There?s an energy to create a better future for the club game,? said one leading executive at the World Cup.

?We?re all flatlining, surviving, and making ends meet, whereas if you?re really serious about growing the game, we need to look at what formats are open to us and what would it take to be brave enough to step into that new world??

One of the previous sticking points to the concept of uniting the English Premiership and the URC ? which features teams from Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Italy and more recently South Africa ? has been the detrimental impact it would have on the European Champions Cup.

However, one solution has been put forward for an ?FA Cup-style? knock-out competition involving clubs from the French Top 14 to ensure it retains its point of difference within a revised European domestic structure.

Further talks are set to resume following the World Cup next month, which are expected to dive deeper into the detail of how a new league would be structured, with the aim of establishing a new competition within the next three years, to coincide with the introduction of a ?world club championship?.

?For the first time it seems that Premiership Rugby, who had previously said ?no, no, no? to any such talks are open to the idea of looking at a way of creating a kind of super league,? added another source close to the talks.

The Premiership currently consists of 10 clubs following the financial demise of Worcester, Wasps and London Irish last season, while the URC has 16 clubs. The next stage of the negotiations is to look at how integration of the two leagues would work.

?It is complicated, but one proposal would be for two leagues based on merit, and promotion and relegation between the two, or two conferences ? a Premiership and URC one, to qualify for knockout stages,? said another source close to the talks.

?Currently it is quite difficult for one broadcaster to invest in three or four competitions,? said one leading executive at the World Cup. ?Whereas if you form a British and Irish league, it makes the conversations with broadcasters much easier. You could have one rugby channel that increases the value of the broadcasting deal and clubs could grow their attendances. There is validity in it.?

The Six Nations already aggregate their broadcasting and commercial revenues as part of a deal known as ?Project Light? and there is an expectation that a similar arrangement would bolster club finances.

Underpinning the desire for change is also to create more invigorating and attractive domestic club fixtures, including reviving the historically great Anglo-Welsh clashes, as a solution to the challenging financial climate.

?When you get it right, like at this World Cup where you are getting very good teams playing against very good teams and great jeopardy, we should not have to wait four years for that to happen,? a source added.

?Every year there should be unbelievable games. In fairness the European final this year was incredible, but we need to get more moments like that.

?This is a leadership issue thing as well. We are seeing executives who are no longer the traditional ?blazers? but more forward-thinking people who are trying to really grow the game but also in some respects, bring back some of the great stuff we?ve lost: the great derbies and rivalries of yesteryear.?

The prospect of an Anglo-Welsh league was first tabled in Jan 1999, when the Welsh Rugby Union were offered five places for Welsh clubs in the English league system. The offer was turned down, however, with the WRU instead forging ahead with a link with Scotland and Ireland to establish the Celtic League, which evolved into the Pro 12 and now the URC.

An Anglo-Welsh Cup was established in 2005, involving 12 Premiership and four Welsh clubs, as a knockout tournament but was replaced by the Premiership Rugby Cup in 2018.

Revelations about talks over new domestic league structure come just a week before the World Rugby council is due to sign off a new ?Nations Championship? tournament involving teams from the Six Nations and Rugby Championship, set to start in 2026, which will be held every two years to avoid clashes with the World Cup and Lions tours.
Let me tell you something cucumber

RogerE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1323
  • Old Wasps Player (Not saying which team and when!)
    • View Profile
So at the same time as the RFU are discussing the future of the Championship and Premiership 2, they are also talking about joining-up the remnants of the PRL with those from other countries.

Where will this leave "Premiership2" and those Clubs that may have seen it as a lifeline (such as the reformed Wasps, Ealing, Coventry)

baldpaul101

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1701
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
I can see some of the benefits but some of the reasoning just misses the point entirely. "the RWC has been great, so can we re-create that excitement etc every week"... well no, you can't. Its exactly because the RWC is every 4 years, just like a Lions tour, that makes its special. If you had a world cup every year, pretty soon people would be bored with it.
As for reviving classic Anglo Welsh rivalry? Thats from like 30-40 years ago, seriously?

Any such merging of competitions needs teams to be on a level. Currently URC teams have no salary caps & are effectively tools of their individual RFUs. How would English teams hope to compete?

bigad82

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 367
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
This smell's very much of CVC.

Neils

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14744
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
This smell's very much of CVC.

Yep totally.
Let me tell you something cucumber

Shugs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4418
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
Crikey, that?s lots of teams. Could end up with Toulouse in prem 2

InBetweenWasp

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1010
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
This smell's very much of CVC.

Yep totally.

+1, has a share of all 3 entities, so combining them to try and increase TV rights/sponsorship which participants then split equally makes sense for them.

Rifleman Harris

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2433
  • Wasps Rugby Fan and MND Runner
    • View Profile
Tow things spring to my mind..

Would the English clubs be able to afford all the extra travel costs?

Would the fans be prepared to spend the additional costs on travel, and how would this impact the spectacle?

I am not at all convinced, but if they want to give it a go, let them.  I couldn't care less to be honest.

Neils

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14744
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
Tow things spring to my mind..

Would the English clubs be able to afford all the extra travel costs?

Would the fans be prepared to spend the additional costs on travel, and how would this impact the spectacle?

I am not at all convinced, but if they want to give it a go, let them.  I couldn't care less to be honest.

Clubs - most not consistently.

Fans - same. Fans, like us maybe, would travel to a few away matches that are reasonably easy/cheap. Plus if away matches ( for example Edinburgh are in Treviso in June this season) are at attractive times of the year maybe more would go.

However I don't think Fans come into this possible equation- it is money from TV first and foremost.
Let me tell you something cucumber

Bloke in North Dorset

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2466
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
Quote
However I don't think Fans come into this possible equation- it is money from TV first and foremost.
When was the last time you heard fans mentioned in any serious way? It would be interesting to see one of the word clouds based on recent statements from the RFU and Premier League representatives, I don't expect fans to be anywhere near front and centre.

Neils

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14744
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
Quote
However I don't think Fans come into this possible equation- it is money from TV first and foremost.
When was the last time you heard fans mentioned in any serious way? It would be interesting to see one of the word clouds based on recent statements from the RFU and Premier League representatives, I don't expect fans to be anywhere near front and centre.

Very true! Maybe had a faint hope.
Let me tell you something cucumber

Sliminator

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 191
  • Wasps Rugby Fan
    • View Profile
Seems like they want to squeeze more money from a rapidly diminishing fan base (which will then likely shrink further an faster).

The stench of CVC is very strong with this one. F1 only recovered when CVC moved on.