Saracens docked 35 points

[Marlow Nick]

Saracens step up PR campaign. They haven't yet lodged their appeal - just bought themselves another week. Loz says it doesn't matter they weren't liked anyway.

No sign of contrition anywhere.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/50407548

Yet more sloppy journalism in support of the Saracens narrative. The salary cap is £6.4m not £7m. Saracens are entitled to maximum credits but that takes them to slightly over £7m not "significantly over £7M" and Daracens do not have more than 69% homegrown. They have demonstrated great skill in developing players but the salary cap defines home grown as having joined before 18 and they do not have 60% that meet this definition

[RBB]

Saracens have appointed a consulting outfit called FTI Consulting to manage the next phases (whatever that may be), and as you would expect all part of Wray's web of business associates. A quick google of FTI Consulting and Nigel Wray threw this up;

https://otp.investis.com/clients/uk/secure_income_reit_plc/rns/regulatory-story.aspx?cid=2129&newsid=1336978

You can see them as a generic email address at the bottom of the document.

Also mentions Nick Leslau who suddenly left The EAs a few weeks ago.

The plot thickens.

[matelot22]

Am I alone in finding Loz's comments sickening? The way their fans, players et al, attribute the dislike down to envy alone really grates with me.......

[Vespula Vulgaris]

This whole thing is genuinely putting me off rugby right now.

Seriously, what is the point in following the Premiership when one team blatantly cheats right out in the open and nothing is done about it?

[TheTameWasp]

This whole thing is genuinely putting me off rugby right now.

Seriously, what is the point in following the Premiership when one team blatantly cheats right out in the open and nothing is done about it?

This sums up my feeling perfectly.

[westwaleswasp]

I agree totally. The shine has gone, and sense of anticipation is much reduced for me. If they let Sarries get away with it, I may consider cancelling my BT subscription and telling them why.

I also feel Lozowski's comments are really ill advised.

[Gaz]

I think we should email/tweet our clubs and PRL to this effect. I am certainly not giving any more of my money to premiership rugby (via tickets, merch or TV) until they can provide assurances that cheats are identified and dealt with.

[Rossm]

Am I alone in finding Loz's comments sickening? The way their fans, players et al, attribute the dislike down to envy alone really grates with me.......

Loz has to keep kissing Wray's ass as he hasn't got a portfolio yet.

[Fats]

I agree totally. The shine has gone, and sense of anticipation is much reduced for me. If they let Sarries get away with it, I may consider cancelling my BT subscription and telling them why.

I also feel Lozowski's comments are really ill advised.

Me too.

[mike909]

Several things stick in the throat, including:

a) McCall suggesting its not all black and white...so cheating isn't rather clear?
b) the self important attitude of "its just everyone else being nasty"
c) The comments from players and other coaches as if its "so unfair"
d) Hiring a PR Company as if its an image issue

I'm mentally excluding the EAs from my Prem viewing/interest - but if nothings done, it will make it hard to bother with the Prem

[Chilham]

One of the things that is pressing my buttons is chat on the Sarries SN site about them signing Cobus Weise, Cips and George Ford.  It's sad that Sarries now have an entitled attitude, so much so, that despite falling foul of the rules and authorities, their fans feel they can still pick-up and great player who is supposedly disenchanted at their existing club.

Saracens have done a great disservice to rugby.  Their own fans may be the most affected.  Change is going to come.  If it doesn't, our game in England is finished.  We may end up with a European league, led by Wray and likely Craig.

[DGP Wasp]

I agree totally. The shine has gone, and sense of anticipation is much reduced for me. If they let Sarries get away with it, I may consider cancelling my BT subscription and telling them why.

I also feel Lozowski's comments are really ill advised.

Yes, I read the Loz quotes this morning.

"Since I've been here we've been pretty much been universally disliked so it's not really new to us," he said.

"That's what happens when you have success and win championships."

No, achieve success fairly and you're grudgingly admired, achieve success by systematically cheating and you're universally disliked.

Hope that's cleared that up for you Loz!

[BG]

Has Skelton and Barritt left? I can't see them ever signing Cips whilst Fazza is there.. Ford on the other hand is very reasonable prediction.

Ford was the one shining beacon for tigers last season. He has been friends with Fazza since schoolboy days and obviously they have a good understanding of each others game.

Tigers aren't exactly, or have been, performing very well for the last few seasons.

Ford's contract may be up this season so he might be thinking of where to go to improve his chances of picking up medals .. obviously taking a wage reduction in the meantime 

[wasps]

That wouldn't surprise me either Chilham.

A European super league essentially for the rich clubs or for prospective owners who think they can make some money by buying a club on the cheap and getting into a big money league at the outset.

[Rifleman Harris]

Actually I can see this happening.  A possible league could be:

- Sacracens, Bath, and Bristol, then 1 of Us, Leicester and Exeter for England,
- Glasgow from Scotland, 
- Osprays, Scarlets  or Cardiff for Wales (I am thinking Osprays, but I don't know enough about Welsh Rugby to know who are the most popular),
- Leinster and Munster for Ireland and
- Stade, Toulon, Racing and Claremont for France (again I don't really know who the most popular / richest clubs are in France)

I would think crowd size and money would be the 2 criteria for competing. Maybe that is why they are so obviously sticking 2 fingers up at everybody else, they already have plans?