Europe 20/21 announced

[andermt]

https://www.epcrugby.com/2020/09/02/new-epcr-tournament-formats-agreed-for-2020-21-season/

Champions Cup for 24 teams, top 8 from Premiership split into 4 tiers

2 pools of 12 teams

No repeats of domestic matches.
Tier 1 will play Tier 4 and Tier 2 will play Tier 3

This will end up with 4 matches, 2 home, 2 away.

Top 8 go through to the 1/4 finals for home & away

Next 8 go to Challenge cup in last 16 stage.

[baldpaul101]

interesting. so if Sarries were to win this seasons ERC, they would qualify as second best prem team of next years ERC....

[Neils]

God they make it confusing. They initially proposed 8 groups of 3 playing home and away with 8 going forward to the Quarters - simple.

[DGP Wasp]

I'm very confused!!

So, assuming Wasps make the top 8, which looks likely, do we play 4 different opponents, 2 home and 2 away, or the same 2 opponents both home and away?

It sounds a bit like the daft Anglo-Welsh Cup format of a few years ago where you are playing matches against teams that you are not actually competing against in your pool.  Pool games will be pretty unexciting.  Wake me up when the quarter finals come round!

[HDAWG]

8 English teams in champions league... I have a problem with that.

In our league even the top 4 can be embarrassing in Europe (3rd and 4th), why extend it from 6 to 8? I really don't find Clermont battering Quins 60-3 entertaining. Just feels like teams after 4th place don't deserve it.

[DGP Wasp]

God they make it confusing. They initially proposed 8 groups of 3 playing home and away with 8 going forward to the Quarters - simple.

Would've made so much more sense!  Pool winners through to Champions Cup quarters; runners up into the Challenge Cup; last place get their BFH!

[Peej]

Why are they constantly fucking with the system? and why have a two-legged QF? Utterly pointless. Less is more

[DGP Wasp]

This makes it a little clearer:

https://d2cx26qpfwuhvu.cloudfront.net/epcr/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/26163234/NEW-Heineken-Champions-Cup-Rules-for-2020-21.pdf

I will now try to answer some of my own questions which might help (or further confuse?) others!

So if we just take current league positions to provide an example of how things might pan out, bearing in mind France's qualifiers and seedings are already decided as they stopped their season back in March.

As with previous seasons, the actual rankings at the end of the season will be based on playoffs, so tier 1 will be the finalists and tier 2 the losing semi-finalists in the Prem and Pro14 regardless of league position.

Tier 1: Exeter / Sale  +  Bordeaux / Lyon  +  Leinster / Edinburgh
Tier 2: Bristol / Wasps  +  Racing / Toulon   +  Ulster / Munster
Tier 3: Bath / Saints  +  La Rochelle / Clermont  +  Scarlets / Glasgow
Tier 4: Quins / Glaws  +  Toulouse / Montpellier  +  Connacht / Dragons

Each tier then has 1 from each league drawn in pool A and the other from each league in pool B (with me so far?)
Pool matches are then tier 1 v tier 4 and tier 2 v tier 3, both home and away, but only against the teams from the other 2 leagues.  So as things stand, Wasps's potential pool opponents would be either La Rochelle or Clermont plus either Scarlets or Dragons.

Will make for some potentially one sided pool games between the tier 1 and 4 teams, and in theory, pretty safe passage for the top seeds through to the quarters where they will again have a more favourable draw.  The interesting games will be those between the tier 3 and 4 teams which will determine the rest of the quarter finalists.  It all seems heavily weighted to favour the top seeds, so shall we just save a lot of messing about and give Leinster the trophy now??

[Heathen]

You will need to be a brain surgeon to work that lot out. As Peej, says why?

I thought the thinking was 4 pool matches H&A, QF, SF & F - 7 games for the finalists. They now add a H and A QF making 8. Looking at the concept, it is almost (although never definite!) certain to deliver the Euro heavyweights to the QFs and TV companies have said we want the H&A matches.

[Neils]

I got a message or a link months ago indicating 8 per league with probably 8 groups of three home and away. To give fans an additional (!) Match they said for one year they would do home and away quarters. All change again. Not missed an away Euro for years but can't see much hope this year.

[Hymenoptera]

Are we expecting too much? This is a Covid related change and yet another attempt at making the best of a bad situation. I assume this way travel is reduced slightly, as is in interaction.
Not great but i'm sure EPRC are doing their best.

[Heathen]

interesting. so if Sarries were to win this seasons ERC, they would qualify as second best prem team of next years ERC....

This year's QF will be a humdinger at the Aviva!

[Neils]

Are we expecting too much? This is a Covid related change and yet another attempt at making the best of a bad situation. I assume this way travel is reduced slightly, as is in interaction.
Not great but i'm sure EPRC are doing their best.

I agree plus three League Committees to satisfy.

[Peej]

Are we expecting too much? This is a Covid related change and yet another attempt at making the best of a bad situation. I assume this way travel is reduced slightly, as is in interaction.
Not great but i'm sure EPRC are doing their best.

Why not simplify it instead then? And it basically means we will have to have cross border travel in France, which I cannot see happening any time soon.

[DGP Wasp]

Are we expecting too much? This is a Covid related change and yet another attempt at making the best of a bad situation. I assume this way travel is reduced slightly, as is in interaction.
Not great but i'm sure EPRC are doing their best.

I agree plus three League Committees to satisfy.

8 pools of 3, with a team from each league in each pool would have achieved exactly the same in terms of number of pool matches and been a whole lot easier to understand.  As far as I can tell, the main difference between that and the 2x12 we've ended up with is that this allows the top seeds from each league to play only those that would ordinarily have found themselves in the Challenge Cup, thereby giving them a nice easy route through and allowing them to rotate their squads against weaker opposition while those in the middle have to scrap it out for the remaining quarter final places.