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Author Topic: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.  (Read 4360 times)

Neils

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #30 on: May 16, 2021, 01:00:09 PM »
I don't buy the assumption that we are going to be weaker next year. With the greatest of respect from the list of leavers the only ones that will impact will be Brookes, Rowlands and Taylor. Rowlands is countered by Stooke (who will be available all year). We're well covered at hooker with another signing mooted. Brookes scrummaging will be missed without question but Scholtz seems to have that as his speciality and JTA has improved there and offers much more in the loose. On the positives Hougaard is an international quality stand in for Robson. Crossdale is a promising young player who can cover a few positions and apparently we have more signings to come. We'll have academy step ups as well. And importantly the likes of Oghre, Barbeary, Atkinson, Umaga, Cardall, T Willis have got serious prem gametime which will stand them in good stead. I see us kicking on.

With you on this PLUS the whole team will get a substantial rest unlike the 10 days they got between seasons this year. Time for a good working pre-season.
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Shugs

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #31 on: May 16, 2021, 01:40:08 PM »
Agreed, although from a selfish Wasps point of view it is feasible that Shields, West, Robson, Odogwu, Umaga and even Barbeary could be part of a summer tour. I suppose given past experiences that might constitute a non playing break in itself.

JonnyD

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #32 on: May 16, 2021, 01:47:24 PM »
I don't buy the assumption that we are going to be weaker next year. With the greatest of respect from the list of leavers the only ones that will impact will be Brookes, Rowlands and Taylor. Rowlands is countered by Stooke (who will be available all year). We're well covered at hooker with another signing mooted. Brookes scrummaging will be missed without question but Scholtz seems to have that as his speciality and JTA has improved there and offers much more in the loose. On the positives Hougaard is an international quality stand in for Robson. Crossdale is a promising young player who can cover a few positions and apparently we have more signings to come. We'll have academy step ups as well. And importantly the likes of Oghre, Barbeary, Atkinson, Umaga, Cardall, T Willis have got serious prem gametime which will stand them in good stead. I see us kicking on.

With you on this PLUS the whole team will get a substantial rest unlike the 10 days they got between seasons this year. Time for a good working pre-season.

Throw in another starting quality lock, a squad lock and another backrower and our pack could finally have a bit of clout about it - especially with a fit Alo or Scholtz.

Stooke/AN Other could be much more preferable to the enigma that is Rowlands - obviously around all year but maybe more consistent. Rowlands was absolute class against Quins in every aspect of his game and then looked a shadow of his former self against Worcester - need a player like him to have really dominated that game to get us moving forward

RogerE

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #33 on: May 16, 2021, 02:11:47 PM »
At the end of the Quins match Rowlands looked like he was "running on empty" and it was that which caused him to give away the penalty that led Quin's winning try. Yesterday it seemed like he was running on nearly empty.

Hopefully a couple of weeks rest will do him a world of good in time for Saints.

Covkid40

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #34 on: May 16, 2021, 03:16:06 PM »
Don’t think anybody has said we will be worse next season, I just don’t see us being any better. Yes the players leaving have sort of been replaced ie stooke for rowlands but if we have a similar squad quality wise next season then the end result will be similar. People keep saying we are well stocked at hooker. Are we? Alfie is a complete unknown at this level at hooker, Gabby for me isn’t good enough and Tom can’t play every week and we have no idea who this new hooker is going to be

NellyWellyWaspy

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #35 on: May 16, 2021, 09:43:46 PM »
It isn't about the quality of players. any of use who have played (my guess most of us) recognise that they are all quality. The lack of quality comes from a lack of cohesiveness and lack of rugby brain. By lack I mean either it isn't there (and for me Fekitoa demonstrates that perfectly on Saturday), or lack of willingness of the player to back themselves when they know what the right thing to do is. And by that I mean, ignore what the coaches planned. I think way too many of the team demonstrate a lack of rugby 'brain' by either measure.

I posted on Facebook some basic 'rules'. One of which was, NEVER try to jackal in your own half. Why? The penalty is kickable, or you will end up with a lineout against you 5 metres out. It isn't worth that risk. Referees will be far more likely to see holding on as a defensive ploy by the tackled player if they are well in to their own half. But, they will side with the attackers if they are in your half, and accuse you of slowing the ball down.

Most of the other 'rules' Wasps (for once) stuck to. My view on the jackal is that you should leave it to a specialist, like Jack. Backs should never try it. They almost always get pinged.

We failed to heap the points on in the first half due to lack of imagination. The players stuck to the plan. And Wuss had that figured from the get go. In the second half, Wuss had figured out how to dismantle our game plan. And that has happened to us in every game for months. Time maybe for no game plan?

The thing is, on paper we DO have a good squad. A top 6 or even top 4 squad. We do keep making the mistake of signing players already known to be made of glass (like Mills), or extending such players (like Watson). Times are hard, money is tight. Yes, players get injured, but we can't afford to sign someone who has a record of injuries with long layoffs.

We CAN do better, but not as we are. We NEED to bin the game plans, force the players to think on their feet.

Heathen

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #36 on: May 17, 2021, 07:13:29 AM »
We failed to heap the points on in the first half due to lack of imagination.

How many kickable penaties did we turn down in the first half?

We have to have a pragmatic appreoach to accumulating points. Every game should be treated as KO rugby in our current position. We could have been at least another 12 points up at HT. Take the points on offer and if the margin is still very positive heading into the last quarter, we should then be able to close out the game without the disasters that have beset us so often this season.

Peej

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #37 on: May 17, 2021, 08:38:13 AM »
Our decision making about when to take points and when to go for tries has been poor all season. There were times we definitely should have gone for the sticks but when for big plays (that mostly didn't come off), and then times where we decided to take 3 after loads of pressure and with clear advantages in scrummaging etc...

RogerE

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #38 on: May 17, 2021, 09:18:59 AM »
Also we kept on trying the forward pods pick and go when ot was obvious they were more than adequate at defending it.

Mix it up - use the backs and keep then guessing.

Bloke in North Dorset

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #39 on: May 17, 2021, 10:38:15 AM »
Also we kept on trying the forward pods pick and go when ot was obvious they were more than adequate at defending it.

Mix it up - use the backs and keep then guessing.
I'd generally agree with that point, but at the start of the first half it was persisting down to the point the commentators raised it as an issue. Its a difficult call in those conditions and I wouldn't hold it against them either way.

Neils

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #40 on: May 17, 2021, 10:44:27 AM »
Also we kept on trying the forward pods pick and go when ot was obvious they were more than adequate at defending it.

Mix it up - use the backs and keep then guessing.
I'd generally agree with that point, but at the start of the first half it was persisting down to the point the commentators raised it as an issue. Its a difficult call in those conditions and I wouldn't hold it against them either way.

I suppose in this case they may have relied on Biyi too much - seeing what he could do BUT somebody should have pulled the plug after a few failures.
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Peej

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #41 on: May 17, 2021, 11:41:28 AM »
Also we kept on trying the forward pods pick and go when ot was obvious they were more than adequate at defending it.

Mix it up - use the backs and keep then guessing.
I'd generally agree with that point, but at the start of the first half it was persisting down to the point the commentators raised it as an issue. Its a difficult call in those conditions and I wouldn't hold it against them either way.

I suppose in this case they may have relied on Biyi too much - seeing what he could do BUT somebody should have pulled the plug after a few failures.

To be fair, we aren't alone in this sort of play so close to the line.

RogerE

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #42 on: May 17, 2021, 11:54:04 AM »
True, and that's my point.

Most teams are now setup to defend the pick and go, but if they know you MIGHT do that or MIGHT pass the ball wide (especially if it is using fast flat passes) they will not be sure of how to setup their defence.

Or, based on my playing experience (ok many years ago) forwards just get white line fever and refuse to let the scrum half interfere. :)

WonkyWasp

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #43 on: May 17, 2021, 01:51:51 PM »
As long as they play as a team and not separate entities ....  I'm happy.

hookender

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Re: Wasps V Worcester: Post Match Thoughts.
« Reply #44 on: May 17, 2021, 02:15:39 PM »