Alfie's season of extremes set to roll into England's tour of Australia.

[Rossm]

'Hit him hard'

Report from Bobby Bridge.

https://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sport/rugby/hit-him-hard-alfie-barbearys-24017454

[wasps]

I know we'd mostly all come around to this way of thinking, but the article refers to him as Wasps No.8


That should put to bed any discussions of playing hooker, centre or full back


some of us may think Tom Willis is the better all round 8, while still acknowledging that Alfie has a specific skill set that is hard to match.
Either way, we've often talked about 2 players in every position, and that's definitely what we have at the back of the scrum

[Marlow Nick]

If Alfie wants to pin down 8 for Wasps and England he's got a lot of work to do on his scrummaging technique. I'm always nervous when I see him trying to control the ball if the scrum is moving or if the opposition 9 is in close.

[wasps]

If Alfie wants to pin down 8 for Wasps and England he's got a lot of work to do on his scrummaging technique. I'm always nervous when I see him trying to control the ball if the scrum is moving or if the opposition 9 is in close.

Agree completely.
I occasionally played 8, but I learnt quickly that although I was powerful when I picked it up and ran forward, I was not good at controlling the ball at the base, or protecting the 9.... To the point where I never really felt confident.




When Alfie was first playing 8, it was evident it was a new position to him.
His control was noticeably poor, some of his decision making when picking the ball up wasn't great and looked like it was relying purely on power, and it seemed that neither he nor the scrum half were really communicating effectively.


He's obviously still not mastered it all, but there is definite improvement in all areas, and continuing to play at 8 will only help that.
A good rest and preseason would likely see it all come in leaps and bounds, but that's probably out of the question

[Shugs]

Lots of debate at 8 where we have Barbeary, T Willis and Carr. Whatever the relative strengths of that trio that is far from being our problem - quite the opposite. Our focus needs to be on fixing  9-15.

[WonkyWasp]

I admire Alfie very much  and admire his amazing variety of skills and abilities, but for me  -  he ain't no number 8.  He might like playing there  but  it isn't his best placing.  He just doesn't seems to have the  ... I don't know quite ....  what is needed for an 8.  ?Too slow in responses?  Not fast enough?  Not slick enough?  I don't know!  Just doesn't feel right.  Tom Willis  conversely is text book 8,  and more besides.  Why -  for this important match  -  why is he wasted sitting 'on the bench'?  Unless he's injured.  No answer expected!  Signed,  Confused of Clodock.

[wasps]

Alfie gets picked ahead of Tom because his X factor is his ability to break the gain line.


We have very little of that in the team and given how much of an attack can be built in even a half line break, I can understand why he's in the team.


Add I've said elsewhere, I agree entirely that Tom had the better No8 skillset, but Alfie is constantly improving.


I'm not sure where else we play him if not at 8

[hookender]

I'm not sure where else we play him if not at 8

There have been many suggestions

[WonkyWasp]

Genuine question . . . . but he does play at others, doesn't he?  And why in an important match  do you play the tyro when you already have a proven finished (or very nearly) article to hand?  Can't see the sense.

[wasps]

Genuine question . . . . but he does play at others, doesn't he?  And why in an important match  do you play the tyro when you already have a proven finished (or very nearly) article to hand?  Can't see the sense.

I don't think I've seen Alfie play anywhere but 8.


When he and Tom have been on the pitch together, I think I've seen Tom at flanker.


He's never played senior rugby at hooker that I'm aware of.


He may have packed down at 6 a few times, but I don't recall it

[WonkyWasp]

Tom has been playing at No 8 since 2017,  and in the U20s and U22s (not sure if I got the ages right!)  where he was also captaining them.  He also played at 8 when I sponsored him, I''ve got one of his '8' shirts, and  he has a long history of playing 8.  It's in Whickapedia  (or however it's spelt!)  and the Offy site  thinggy of Club players. So, yes, he has played 8 before  -  quite a fair bit.

[wasps]

Tom has been playing at No 8 since 2017,  and in the U20s and U22s (not sure if I got the ages right!)  where he was also captaining them.  He also played at 8 when I sponsored him, I''ve got one of his '8' shirts, and  he has a long history of playing 8.  It's in Whickapedia  (or however it's spelt!)  and the Offy site  thinggy of Club players. So, yes, he has played 8 before  -  quite a fair bit.

I said that I believe Alfie has only ever played 8.


Tom is obviously a No.8 too, and for a long while, but has occasionally played on the flank as well

[Marlow Nick]

Tom has been playing at No 8 since 2017,  and in the U20s and U22s (not sure if I got the ages right!)  where he was also captaining them.  He also played at 8 when I sponsored him, I''ve got one of his '8' shirts, and  he has a long history of playing 8.  It's in Whickapedia  (or however it's spelt!)  and the Offy site  thinggy of Club players. So, yes, he has played 8 before  -  quite a fair bit.

... Which is what worries me. He's been playing 8 for so long but still hasn't mastered one 9f the key skills of the role.

[WonkyWasp]

Sorry 'wasps'  -  I obviously mis-read you, for which many apologies.  Yes, he has played at 7, but mainly at 8 while I'm pretty sure Alfie has played in other places as well.  It must be a bit difficult when there is such a gifted player available  -  difficult for boss and player.  Nick, you know so much more than me  but surely ar 23 Tom is still learning.  But I'm no way as knowledgeable as you so I will bow to you   ...  no sarcasm  intended.

[WonkyWasp]

Having slept on it I still think we should  play Tom at 8.