Match Thread

[Shugs]

Reffing has been Woodthorpesque. He doesn’t see much. But we needed to win this one first 40 when we had some first teamers on. Overpowered second 40 and too many errors. Disappointed by Odogwu and Vukasinovic in particular but Hartley, Fisilau and Haydon-Wood looked good.

[DGP Wasp]

I hope someone tells Greg Fisilau that Austin Healey thinks he is a bit of a pussy who has been dominated by the Tigers 8 today.

Austin appears to have revised his opinion there, heaping praise on Fisilau at the end. Think only the scoreline stopped him from getting MoM.

[Steve from Cov]

Good game but Tigers forward dominance - driving maul and jackaling - won the game.

Healey talking up Fisalau. Their number 7 was awesome.

Our first half scrum was strong and most of our youngsters played well - many will turn out to be top drawer. Impressive performances by Fisalau, both our half backs and Hartley.

Nothing to worry about really.

[Bloke in North Dorset]

“  Hartley, Fisilau and Haydon-Wood looked good.”

I don’t think Fisilau is ready but the other 2 have earned the right for a Prem start.

[Vespula Vulgaris]

Nice bit of tactical selection from Borthwick.

He could see Wasps have a tendency to be flakey and cave in the 2nd half when under a little pressure, so ensured he had some nice chunky subs to come of the bench.

Pretty standard for Wasps I think. Some moments of skill, but an overall lack of resilience both mentally and physically

I suspect we'll be saying the same all season..

[backdoc]

I think Stooke and Koch [sounds like an end of pier comedy duo from the 60's] will add steel to the pack.
Martinez certainly did for the first half.

[InBetweenWasp]

I hope someone tells Greg Fisilau that Austin Healey thinks he is a bit of a pussy who has been dominated by the Tigers 8 today.

Austin appears to have revised his opinion there, heaping praise on Fisilau at the end. Think only the scoreline stopped him from getting MoM.

I'm not sure there was a reversal - Healey was extremely complimentary about Fisilau and it felt (to me) that he gave him a lot of airtime.  His point was that it's a big step up to Prem Rugby from U20 and a big part of Fisilau's development will be to be able to carry on his physicality and step it up to compete with the Prem, the example he drew was that the Tigers No.8 won all the collisions vs Fisilau.  It was a pretty fair point.

On the other hand, thought he was extremely critical of the Tigers starting 10.

[InBetweenWasp]

“  Hartley, Fisilau and Haydon-Wood looked good.”

I don’t think Fisilau is ready but the other 2 have earned the right for a Prem start.

I thought Hartley was a 12 coming through the ranks? - He's got some similarities to Freddie Steward - Tall, good physicality and decent pace.  Haydon-Wood looked very assured.

[Jac A]

That was surprisingly disappointing. I agree with a lot of what's been said here.

In terms of players the generally positive for me were:
Fisilau - as others said, agree with Healy: great engine and work-rate, looks to have a good rugby brain too, ran some good lines. Just out muscled a bit. A year with S&C and the dietician putting on 4-5kgs while keeping the energy round the park could see him become very effective considering he's only 19.

McArthur - the scrum wasn't as dominant in the second half when Martinez went off, but it didn't go backwards despite Tigers bringing on the very experienced Leatigaga. Round the park he looked full of energy, quick, hit hard. He reminds me a bit of Matt Mullan. More scrum experience and I think he could be a player. Should have had a try too.

Hartley - best of our youngsters. Looks to have a high rugby IQ - made some very good decisions, big boot, strong. Definitely a 12 for me though. I wouldn't have him ahead of Burger or Mills yet, he missed a lot of rugby last year so some more games for Ampthill and PRC but he's the next cab if one of them is unavailable IMO.

Craven - I liked Monye but Craven is a step up as an academy 9. Everything apart from the box kicking was strong. Quick to the ruck, accurate passes, good support lines. Could have taken charge a bit more when we were camped on their line.

Haydon-Wood - Mostly played well. Good in the air, passing, decision making for the most part etc. Wasn't too impressed by his kicking out of hand though. quite a few of his kicks would have been punished far more if Jed Walsh wasn't wearing clown shoes - won't get those chances against the likes of Biggar, Farrel, Ford etc - so would have liked to see more of his running game.

Dawkins - Fumbled a pass early but took his try really well. Reminded me a bit of Caden Murley.

Disspointments:
Curran - I've been a big fan of Keiran's and have been hoping this will be his breakthrough year but in all honesty, he was outplayed by his opposite number in every respect. Two scrums he was very slow to get away from and as a 7 that's not great as you leave your 10 very exposed.

Simonds - Some good passes but also some bad decision making. A couple of times he looked like he didn't know what to do and dithered and made a silly error in the double roll.

Vukasinovic - Mostly for not having a plan to stop their maul which crushed us. He should have been lineout leader and mixing up how we defended. We put a jumper up almost every time and they had no impact and left us exposed. Could have tried sacking the catcher as soon as they landed or setting for the drive. Also missed a couple of tackles.

[mike909]

Re-watched the second half this morning. I think a number of the younger Wasps player ought to be pleased with their game if not the outcome. Watching the 60 to 68th minute - you could see how decisions by officials can turn a game. And this game was no different. We 90%+ did score on their line and the ref really ought to have given a warning for repeated infringements. That would as Austin noted - have been tied scores - and for me, ought to have been a card.

I really thought the ref was doing an ok job at the breakdown in the fist half - but in the second half - and looking back to the first, he was rather flaky on the ruck Laws - especially a) the tackler needing to release and b) when a ruck is formed - it only needs one player from each side. The Tigers 7 is an astounding player but was regularly aided in the SH by the officiating. Even Austin hinted at this...Ditto the "collapsing the maul" - too often seemed to make it the defenders' responsibility to keep the maul up.

Observations about us. I know right wing gets less ball as they get passes off the left hand but when we have such a talent...surely we need to get the ball to him? And if we are one out again and again on their line - surely we ought to use the threats that have worked - drive, get cover in ruck, quick ball away to the backline?

General observation. I've been critical of the problems defending mauls where it looks too much like legal obstruction - especially near the line. But the Tigers success in this area (over the line) seems at least in part deliberately collapsing the maul - but over the line so "held" up (If I am wrong here please say!) That seems wrong. Or has Borthwick's team seen something others haven't?

Given the first half and the way the scrum went and how some of the very young players responded - not going to get too depressed by that.

[Westy68]

Very similar thoughts, was really looking forward to this game and expecting a better performance. We really got physically battered which is so disappointing and unfortunately so familiar.

Both locks were poor, Paolo was really bad, maybe needs more game time.

Fisilau does look decent lots of energy but to be a quality 8 he has got to be stronger, only 19 but that is likely to change, definitely a player to keep an eye on. I like Feyi-Waboso an exciting runner. Olly Hartley is a good player.

Overall was disappointed, our DNA when we won things was, physically and mentally strong, we had the 'you shall not pass' attitude that I loved about Wasps 

[Shugs]

Don’t think we need to get downhearted by this. We’re talking about quite a few players who have had no recent rugby at all. I think as much as anything else the laws need drumming into the likes of Dodson and Feyi-Waboso. The two main worries I had coming out of it were Simonds needs to show something soon. For me he’s already behind Odendaal, Mills and Hartley and he’s been around for a while. Locks - I know we have Stooke to come back and I’m happy with Launch, McDonald and Cardall but over a season that’s not much depth and Dodson and Vukasinovic look a good way off Prem standard at the minute.

[DGP Wasp]

only 19 but that is likely to change

In another year or so he might be 20!

[Peej]

There were times where if the ball had been moved quicker, or just one pass given, we would have opened Tigers up. It was really poor to be camped on their line and not have the nous to at least try Paolo's power and pace.

Not surprised Paolo looked off the pace given these are his first minutes of the season. Simonds also looked really rusty actually.

Hartley did a good job at 15, WHW again did pretty well at 10. Fisilau impressed with his engine and constant carrying, but Fyn Brown also looked good in that lock/6 role.

[JonnyD]

Not sure whether Fisilau has the ultimate size at the top level at 8.
His strengths are his work rate, link play and his speed, he was absolutely everywhere yesterday.

If he can shadow Nemo for the next few years that would be fantastic, but I wonder whether a shift to 7 might happen as Ilione has. Problem is, with him, Tunney and Cripps coming through, they’re all probably fighting out to become 7s with Curran just ahead of them.
Not sure we’ll be able to keep them all.

I agree Simonds has to push on now, he’s 22, the same age as Spink, has served his time with Nottingham, recent experience at Manly, overcome some big injuries and now needs to show what he’s about as Hartley is probably ahead of him now at 12 and 15.

Think we lacked a slightly more experienced bench option in the second row or back row to come and steady things.