England

[Shugs]

Don’t be fooled VV. Japan were really poor.

[mike909]

Morning Shugs - I think that whatever England did in that game - we'd learn nothing. It seemed a lot like the game (ancient history) I watched in Oz in '87 at the RWC when England with some much better (comparatively) players like Rory U etc, put 60 on Japan - but had a dominant front row and line and it looked like a practice game.

It told us nothing wither - as they lost in the 1/4 to Wales....

As Guscott noted in the Rugby Paper - England need to improve, lots, really quickly...Can't disagree - as they are otherwise likely to find the games vs SA and NZ a bit of a "challenge". Especially if the selection focus still seems to be on power, whilst ignoring pace. It was odd watching Bath - Tigers game on Friday. I seemed to have on view some better England qualified players - than were in the England squad. Lawrence is on fire, Watson looked like his normal self etc.

Really need to see some hope vs NZ next Saturday - as if we allow any quick ball  - they aren't exactly going to spurn their opportunities...Pressure's off NZ, if anything, on tour and time to move on a little. Looked v dangerous vs what seemed a stale Wales. we'll see vs Scotland how they are shaping up.

[westwaleswasp]

And surely England's impressive tour vs Australia is also put into perspective by yesterday's result.
Losing to Arg, NZ and the Boks would be awful. So what we need is a W, and that will be hard. I think one match might be possible. The Boks are currently 0/2 though, so you expect that bubble to burst.

[Shugs]

Morning Shugs - I think that whatever England did in that game - we'd learn nothing. It seemed a lot like the game (ancient history) I
watched in Oz in '87 at the RWC when England with some much better (comparatively) players like Rory U etc, put 60 on Japan - but had a dominant front row and line and it looked like a practice game.

It told us nothing wither - as they lost in the 1/4 to Wales....

As Guscott noted in the Rugby Paper - England need to improve, lots, really quickly...Can't disagree - as they are otherwise likely to find the games vs SA and NZ a bit of a "challenge". Especially if the selection focus still seems to be on power, whilst ignoring pace. It was odd watching Bath - Tigers game on Friday. I seemed to have on view some better England qualified players - than were in the England squad. Lawrence is on fire, Watson looked like his normal self etc.

Really need to see some hope vs NZ next Saturday - as if we allow any quick ball  - they aren't exactly going to spurn their opportunities...Pressure's off NZ, if anything, on tour and time to move on a little. Looked v dangerous vs what seemed a stale Wales. we'll see vs Scotland how they are shaping up.

Agree Mike. I know Jones can’t win in that he has to win but is always being told to experiment. But really. Surely it was a chance to play Willis in the back row instead of Itoje. Apart from anything else Itoje is going to be asked to go full pelt in the other two games. We learnt that Van Poortvliet is a better option that Youngs. But it was always going to be the game to draw least conclusions from as Japan were really poor. The next two games are key.

[petros]

I just hope Jack is on the bench this time. Rumours have Simmons and Billy V starting with Itoje at lock

[mike909]

Seen the squad for the NZ game - it seems that pace isn't a priority and Jones is hoping that OF and MT in the centres will "do a RWC SF" whilst by some miracle, BV, SS and TC will managed to compete as a back row..

We must be keeping our powder ultra dry if that selection with Nowell on the wing is supposed to look something like our best set up. No Malins, no Watson so Radwan no Freeman, no pace and Youngs on the bench to "finish".....No lineout option at No. 8.

If NZ get possession - it's going to be a long afternoon.....Even with the glimmer of hope at starting 9 and Smith at 10, the backs who played for Bath and Tigers last time offered a better choice than the selection England have decided upon.

[Shugs]

Small mercies Mike. At least he’s ditched the lock to back row nonsense. Ok he’s put a number 8 there but we can’t have everything. If Sam Simmonds is a better flanker than Jack Willis I must have been watching the game in a parallel universe. As you say, no pace apart from May in the backs so just line em up and knock ‘em down for NZ.

[mike909]

In some ways Shugs - it's more about the "whole". There's something not working between changing room and coaching side. It's been recorded how Jones oft loses the changing room - but you can see it in the bizarre performances in the last couple of 6Ns etc. 2021, we were terrible vs Scotland, and Wales, both of whom out thought us - beat France in a great team performance and lost badly to Ireland. 2022 6Ns - out thought in Scotland and Ireland and France didn't have to play well to win easily.

Easily could win vs NZ, but frankly given recent form, I'd not be confident I could see a plan....Of course, we might still be holding our cards close to our chest....and the plan will emerge next year...

[westwaleswasp]

You would think England won't lose both remaining fixtures.
I think England will raise their game for both. This is what happens when you lose to Argentina  and forget to book Jones' bunnies the Aussies.
The fixture list probably looked fab in the summer, albeit with Arg and Jpn the wrong way round. Now there us a must win element in the last two weeks- to lose 3 from 4 with no tier one win ould be unthinkable with  the 6n containing two clearly better teams and two who Eddie keeps contrivancing to lose to. 
It's a blue home year, making Wales away one of the fixtures, and Ire away. Can't see them being wins, and Fra at home is looking dicey.

[JonnyD]

Let’s play a lock at 6 for the last two years and then let’s just change it out of no where

[DGP Wasp]

two clearly better teams and two who Eddie keeps contrivancing to lose to. 

Word of the day!

I challenge all on here to use it at least once in conversation before the day is out!

[FrankWasp]

The way Italy are playing that could easily be a maybe as well!

[Westy68]

I obviously don't know anything about rugby, as I thought Jack would be a better flanker then Simmonds and I can think of 3 players better then Nowell. Clearly Jones knows what he is doing and we will win the next 2 games

[Neils]

I obviously don't know anything about rugby, as I thought Jack would be a better flanker then Simmonds and I can think of 3 players better then Nowell. Clearly Jones knows what he is doing and we will win the next 2 games

Yay let's cheer the Ed of Knowledge!

[westwaleswasp]

two clearly better teams and two who Eddie keeps contrivancing to lose to. 

Word of the day!

I challenge all on here to use it at least once in conversation before the day is out!

The neologism is, of course, a typo. However, it is my intention to make "to Eddie Jones" a verb meaning to put together a device using what is to hand without recourse to the various parts' actual purposes.