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Author Topic: Ben Jacobs interview  (Read 2111 times)

Neils

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Ben Jacobs interview
« on: April 25, 2023, 08:05:44 PM »
Ex-Aussie star Ben Jacobs says rugby needs to learn from Formula One https://mol.im/a/12011227 via https://dailym.ai/android
Let me tell you something cucumber

NellyWellyWaspy

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2023, 09:36:34 PM »
Ex-Aussie star Ben Jacobs says rugby needs to learn from Formula One https://mol.im/a/12011227 via https://dailym.ai/android

The day rugby union goes the way of F1, I am out of the door for good. As will a lot of fans. In will come rich idiots and ruin it. The guy must have brain damage.

COYW15

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2023, 09:16:35 AM »
Ex-Aussie star Ben Jacobs says rugby needs to learn from Formula One https://mol.im/a/12011227 via https://dailym.ai/android

The day rugby union goes the way of F1, I am out of the door for good. As will a lot of fans. In will come rich idiots and ruin it. The guy must have brain damage.

God forbid rugby becomes a truly global sport, generating mass interest and attracting new audiences!

baldpaul101

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2023, 09:27:20 AM »
He makes very good points. Rugby needs to learn from other sports how to market itself. There's pages & pages of posts on here slagging off the RFU & PRL for being unprofessional & out of touch, yet someone suggest they need to learn from a very successful global sport & he's "brain damaged"?

I would also add that supporters like Nelly & many others on here (myself included) are not the people rugby needs to attract to survive. the reason its stuggling is because it has always been a niche sport. If it wants to be more than that it needs to attract new fans.

DGP Wasp

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2023, 10:39:48 AM »
The day rugby union goes the way of F1, I am out of the door for good. As will a lot of fans. In will come rich idiots and ruin it. The guy must have brain damage.

Bit late to worry about that!

westwaleswasp

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2023, 04:29:44 PM »
F1 is a fix though. Giving more money to Ferrari for them being Ferrari, and arranging for them to pick up Schumacher from Benetton in the way they did. Can you imagine if the premier league paid United more money for being United and arranged a behind the scenes transfer of Haaland because United threatened to pull out of the prem? There would have been uproar. F1 is as bent as a dog's hind leg, a major spectacle like wrestling, but not a sport for me as it once was.
Saying rugby needs to learn from f1 is facile, and ultimately misses the point- rugby is a ball game that competes in a world that already has many dominant ball games, one played in a very narrow group of countries that are geographically spread.  F1 is not a participation sport-it is an M sport where it was already the biggest fish some while back and has been global for decades. Rugby can't learn from it any more than I can learn how to tap dance by watching Bruce Forsyth.

MarleyWasp

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2023, 04:50:18 PM »
Formula One has changed significantly since CVC sold to Liberty Media in late 2016/early 2017 and Bernie Ecclestone was forced out. That was when Netflix came in with Drive to Survive and interest in the sport took off. The whole organisation is a lot more fairly run, with budget caps and less favours for certain teams. I don't think it's perfect by any means, but it's certainly a different sport from 10 years ago, let alone the 1990s.

westwaleswasp

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2023, 11:20:08 PM »
But rather like the prem, all it takes is the corruption shite to ruin everything after. A bit like scum at the PRL not removing titles that all club rugby fans recognise as not won and failing to relegate said club for a good five years.

Bloke in North Dorset

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2023, 05:33:01 AM »
But rather like the prem, all it takes is the corruption shite to ruin everything after. A bit like scum at the PRL not removing titles that all club rugby fans recognise as not won and failing to relegate said club for a good five years.
Note to Mods. I accidentally hit report when scrolling on my iPad.

westwaleswasp

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2023, 02:13:43 PM »
Never mind, it happens, I think you have to hit report twice anyway.

InBetweenWasp

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2023, 04:56:00 PM »
He's right though, Rugby does need to improve fan engagement.  It doesn't literally need to learn from F1 - I don't think he's suggesting a 'sprint' game is played before the full match, for example.  Rugby has traditionally been seen as a 'mans' sport, complicated to understand to newcomers and lacking action at times - and there's your similarities to F1.

F1 has managed to engage a younger generation of fans, including a healthy number of female fans who aren't traditionally motorsport fans through seeking to show a different side of the sport (with Drive to Survive), try to increase competitiveness (even if it hasn't worked, yet, and may not ever) and produced an ecosystem of content to try and make the sport easier to understand (between Drive to Survive, info on their website, social media posts from Teams and analysis from Pundits on Sky Sports - Brundle regularly 'talks' to newcomers on commentary explaining something that might not be apparent to a newcomer).

I'm optimistic that the behind-the-scenes documentary from this year's 6N will be good for engagement leading into the 2024 6N and there are some great historic rivalries to get into. 

The next step (for me) would be working out a way to pause league games during international periods; both so that people don't have to make a choice between Club/Country but also so that the best players are always in the matchday squads for their Club - making it predictable for more casual fans to come and watch the players they've seen on TV or in an international game.

Thirdly, work out how to deliver a great matchday experience to encourage more families to come along.  There's the short-term benefit of multiples on tickets/F&B/merchandise spending as well as the added longer-term benefit of nurturing a new generation of fans.  Intertwined with this try and limit/reduce the middle-aged, just-out-to-get-hammered 'fans', although this is more an issue at internationals than club games.

JF

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2023, 05:11:32 PM »
Thinking about people who go to watch F1, what do they see of the action other than a noisy blur of cars every couple of minutes? You also need a load of dosh to be able to go to more than the one race a year held in your home country. It's a sport best watched on telly.

Rugby is nothing like that, it needs multiple attendees at multiple sites, the average fan cam, money permitting, see all of their team's home games for a consistent price.

Rugby needs to market itself as the opposite of what many people think it is - elitist, a game for pissed-up braying inbreds. Without new money the professional game in this country cannot continue as it is. Clubs paying money that they don't have for players who play for half a season due to international call-ups or injury.

InBetweenWasp

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2023, 06:36:31 PM »
Rugby needs to market itself as the opposite of what many people think it is - elitist, a game for pissed-up braying inbreds. Without new money the professional game in this country cannot continue as it is. Clubs paying money that they don't have for players who play for half a season due to international call-ups or injury.

Seems like we're broadly in agreement, JF.

MarleyWasp

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2023, 06:50:19 PM »
Thirdly, work out how to deliver a great matchday experience to encourage more families to come along.  There's the short-term benefit of multiples on tickets/F&B/merchandise spending as well as the added longer-term benefit of nurturing a new generation of fans.  Intertwined with this try and limit/reduce the middle-aged, just-out-to-get-hammered 'fans', although this is more an issue at internationals than club games.

PRL could do a lot worse then studying the Canadian Football League. Clubs run on roughly the same budget as Premiership Clubs, yet the loses across the 9 clubs are a fraction of what the Premiership clubs lose a season. Yet they don't skimp on the match day experience and ticket prices aren't ridiculous either. I went to a match in Vancouver last summer and it was a much more enjoyable experience than most rugby experiences in the UK (even if Winnipeg Blue Bombers fans are some of the most annoying sports fans I've ever encountered).

The CFL does have some natural advantages: wider spread of clubs and less competition for spectators for example, but the travel costs are much higher too.

Thinking about people who go to watch F1, what do they see of the action other than a noisy blur of cars every couple of minutes? You also need a load of dosh to be able to go to more than the one race a year held in your home country. It's a sport best watched on telly.

It's not quite that bad, unless you end up with tickets on a fast straight.

I went to the Hungarian Grand Prix in 2015 and sat at a chicane at the far end of the circuit. I had a really good view of two straights, a hairpin and the chicane. As the track is in a valley I could see the end of the start finish straight and the first corner in the distance. There was a big screen in front of me and the PA system was good enough to listen to commentary during the race.

On the flip side I went to the Canadian Grand Prix in 2018. Seats were uncomfortable, the big screen that was opposite the stand I was in the year before was missing and I was sat on a straight so cars were going past pretty fast. Not a lot happened in that race which didn't help.

On the whole I prefer watching on TV. That's not to say it's a bad experience going to races, but many are a long way from anywhere and with travel it's a long old day (admittedly I didn't help myself with the Canadian race by flying from Toronto to Edmonton the morning before to go to Canada v Scotland, then getting the red eye from Edmonton to Montreal the night before the race).

A friend of mine was the account manager for one of the main personal sponsors of a driver who lost his drive at the end of last year and organised hospitality events at a number of races. At some tracks the hospitality sections didn't include views of the tracks, which defies logic to me.

I'm not saying everything F1 does is great: The Miami Grand Prix was a tacky mess in my view, a track around a car park with a fake marina that looked ridiculous, and I'm really not holding out much hope for the Las Vegas race in November, but in terms of building interest, it doesn't do a bad job.

Bloke in North Dorset

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Re: Ben Jacobs interview
« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2023, 07:23:24 PM »

Thirdly, work out how to deliver a great matchday experience to encourage more families to come along.  There's the short-term benefit of multiples on tickets/F&B/merchandise spending as well as the added longer-term benefit of nurturing a new generation of fans. 

The problem is that rugby is a winter sport and that puts off casual supporters, nobody likes hanging around in the pouring rain or freezing cold which means very expensive marquees etc.

To those who claim it should therefore switch to summer the problem is that puts us out of step with the rest of the Northern Hemisphere and unless they all change then it would mean our clubs missing out on European games and make the 6N difficult. It will also probably kill Lions' tours.

And if they can convince everyone else to switch to summer I'm not sure playing internationals or European games in June/July in Rome or the south of France is going to do much for player welfare.

Quote

Intertwined with this try and limit/reduce the middle-aged, just-out-to-get-hammered 'fans', although this is more an issue at internationals than club games.

We've discussed internationals before and although I have access to tickets I refuse to go to Twickenham for that reason. My friends who are honorary stewards told me its got worse in the past couple of years.

I was also disappointed when I was at Sixways for our last game there. There was a group in front of us who were on a stag party and only one or 2 had the vaguest idea what was going on on the pitch, the rest were just drinking and having what they probably considered a great time. They must have got through at least 6 pints in the game and I don't need to describe the disruption that caused. I would have been most miffed if I'd taken children or trying to introduce friends to the game.

I know a lot of clubs have family stands and even alcohol free areas, but you can't always get in to them and that punishes those who like to get a beer at the start and then half time to drink during the game.