Always a Wasp

Author Topic: The salary cap  (Read 6594 times)

wasps

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The salary cap
« on: February 06, 2019, 01:34:48 PM »
It's the current hot topic, so we should have a post here about it.

I think the thing to be aware of if that the cap isn't a simple £7m cap... That's just what they refer to as the base cap.


On top of that £7m, you also have home grown player credits, which if you qualify for the maximum amount, can add an additional £600k per year.

Then there's the international player credits whereby the clubs get an amount of their players miss premiership or European games because of international fixtures.

Senior EPS players get the club £40k +£5k for each missed premiership or international game.

Other international players generate £10k per missed premiership or euro game.


So, if I look at the Saracens squad, they've got 7 players in the EPS squad, so that's an extra £280k. Plus they get £5k per game missed while on international duty, which for most of the EPS players will be 6 games, which would be another £210k.

They also then get £10k per international player for other nations. I'm not entirely sure who of their contingent currently get selected for their Nations, but there's at least 2 that do. If they also miss 6 games, that's an extra £120k



So in total, Saracens' salary cap would likely be about £8.1m

Then there's the overrun allowance where clubs get taxed, like what happened to us and now Quin's. The overrun essentially allows you up to £350k above the base £7m. Admittedly, the tax on that £350k would be over £600k, so I can't see it being abused too much


However, the bottom line is that I suspect Saracens are running with an £8m salary cap, and if there's any truth in them being able to offer slightly lower salaries in exchange for silverware, even if it's just £10k per player, then it may well allow them to fit everyone in

Raggs

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2019, 01:42:00 PM »
I believe the base is 6.4 isn't it?

wasps

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2019, 01:50:14 PM »
I believe the base is 6.4 isn't it?

I thought that was last season.

I'll double check

wasps

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2019, 01:51:24 PM »
I believe the base is 6.4 isn't it?

It was £6.5m in the 16/17 season.
Last season, this season and next season at least it is £7m

Raggs

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2019, 02:13:57 PM »
I believe the base is 6.4 isn't it?

It was £6.5m in the 16/17 season.
Last season, this season and next season at least it is £7m

£6.4m, the £7m includes the available academy credits.

https://d2cx26qpfwuhvu.cloudfront.net/premier/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/03161651/Salary-Cap-Regulations-2018-19.pdf

Page 12.

Hymenoptera

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2019, 02:23:20 PM »
Slice it, dice it..whatever you want...add some eye's, some common sense and some maths and the dish is the same.

Marlow Nick

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2019, 02:53:34 PM »
Out of interest if someone associated with Saracens decided to pay £100k to buy 0.1% of the non-voting shares in  a coffee shop with no dividend rights would that get counted in the salary cap?

Tervueren

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2019, 03:00:01 PM »
Possibly covered by "Payment in kind a player would not have received were not for his involvement with a Club", if spotted.

mike909

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2019, 03:12:33 PM »
Out of interest if someone associated with Saracens decided to pay £100k to buy 0.1% of the non-voting shares in  a coffee shop with no dividend rights would that get counted in the salary cap?

It would certainly interest our tax authorities...

wasps

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2019, 03:17:29 PM »
I believe the base is 6.4 isn't it?

It was £6.5m in the 16/17 season.
Last season, this season and next season at least it is £7m

£6.4m, the £7m includes the available academy credits.

https://d2cx26qpfwuhvu.cloudfront.net/premier/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/03161651/Salary-Cap-Regulations-2018-19.pdf

Page 12.

Ok, yip.
I've reread the page I was reading and see now that the £600k is included in the £7m, providing you qualify for all of it.
However, I think that on the whole most clubs do.


The international player credits do give a club like Saracens about another £500k to play with though

Raggs

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2019, 04:05:30 PM »
I believe the base is 6.4 isn't it?

It was £6.5m in the 16/17 season.
Last season, this season and next season at least it is £7m

£6.4m, the £7m includes the available academy credits.

https://d2cx26qpfwuhvu.cloudfront.net/premier/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/03161651/Salary-Cap-Regulations-2018-19.pdf

Page 12.

Ok, yip.
I've reread the page I was reading and see now that the £600k is included in the £7m, providing you qualify for all of it.
However, I think that on the whole most clubs do.


The international player credits do give a club like Saracens about another £500k to play with though

They definitely have more space than most, no arguments there.

But they have that space exactly because they have internationals all over the pitch, and on the bench, and it really doesn't cover their value all that much.

Itoje and Farrell, two of the best paid players in the league. You really think that Jamie George signed for a pittance after being 3x British and Irish lion hooker? Or that Mako and Billy, two of the best in the world in their positions, have just signed on for low sums either? Lewington would not have been cheap, Spencer had a lot of interest yet has volunteered to continue on as 2nd choice. Loz has re-signed. Alex Goode must have offers coming out of his ears, he's the perfect AP fullback, not in England contention, but definite European quality. etcetc

If the likes of Josh Bassett are almost leaving us for pots of cash to Saints (only dropped because of their uncertainty in coaching), Thompson to Tigers for similar reasons, JCW and Hughes on £350k and £500k respectively? How on earth can they be under?

wasps

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2019, 04:27:12 PM »

But if all of their top 25 players wanted an average of £300k, then they'd be paying over the cap just on those 25, and the rest of the squad would push them a few million over.

I can't bring by myself to believe that kind of transgression can go unnoticed.


Having said that, it's probably no easier to hide a few grand than it is a few million. If they've found a way to get around it, then it likely won't matter of it's tens of thousands, or hundreds

Hymenoptera

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2019, 04:29:14 PM »
Exactly Raggs.

Winning medals doesn't pay the mortgage off as quickly as a nice payrise, be it there or somewhere else. There's an incentive to stay beyond a paid annual holiday and being able to slap every team mate on the arse for making a tackle.
The whole 'players have short careers' quote works both ways and i'm sure it applies to Sarries employees doesn't it? ..maybe it doesn't, maybe being part of the Wolfpack goes beyond being remunerated.

Raggs

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2019, 04:39:40 PM »

But if all of their top 25 players wanted an average of £300k, then they'd be paying over the cap just on those 25, and the rest of the squad would push them a few million over.

I can't bring by myself to believe that kind of transgression can go unnoticed.


Having said that, it's probably no easier to hide a few grand than it is a few million. If they've found a way to get around it, then it likely won't matter of it's tens of thousands, or hundreds

They've already transgressed and threatened legal action to get it dropped. So first off let's not pretend that they won't do it on a moral level.

Next up is if they can hide it. If they can hide it from the tax man, they can hide it from a potentially non-legally enforceable cap that they can threaten legal action on if they get caught anyway.

BG

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Re: The salary cap
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2019, 05:31:13 PM »
I would expect most players in main senior squads would have their own personal Ltd company which payments are paid into so it would be up to the player and their acountant to sort the tex out.

I doubt PRL have any right to view players bank accountants, they presumably can only inspect the clubs finances.

Players will receive money from a number or sources so it would be very easy for a player to receive additional salary from someone else other than the club (directly from sponsors or even from a company owned by a rich owner).

HMRC wouldn't care where the money came from as long as tax was paid on the income and PRL would be none the wiser.